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Video Encoding for the Dash...?


Guest chaznet

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Guest chaznet

I've been tinkering around with converting some video for my dash. I have CorePlayer so am flexible on the codec. So far I've tried WMV which seemed to work ok, MPG-2 wouldn't play.

There are a lot of settings to try, then it takes quite a while just to encode a 2 minute sample. Will give MP4 a try next.

Any suggestions on codecs, bitrate, dimensions, etc...? Thanks!

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I've been tinkering around with converting some video for my dash. I have CorePlayer so am flexible on the codec. So far I've tried WMV which seemed to work ok, MPG-2 wouldn't play.

There are a lot of settings to try, then it takes quite a while just to encode a 2 minute sample. Will give MP4 a try next.

Any suggestions on codecs, bitrate, dimensions, etc...? Thanks!

yeah pocket div x is great. I also use windows movie maker (comes with XP) and it has a setting for full screen ppc (320x240 x 218kb/s) that looks ok and the size is acceptable.

hth

gr

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Guest chaznet

Thanks everyone -- time consuming tinkering. I've tried pretty much everything here, and have found the best solution (so far) to be nothing mentioned. For testing, I did a 1 minute slice of a video. Frames were 15fps; video bitrate in the mid-300 range; and audio at 96kbs; dimensions 320x240.

Pocket Divx Encoder & Lathe: must've been made for monitors of a different resolution than my laptop -- couldn't click the buttons, select options, etc -- nothing lined up correctly on the program itself, never could get it to do anything so I purchased the commercial version for $5: Lathe. Same thing, not formatted for all screen sizes so none of the selections lined up properly, though I was able to get it going somehow and found my way to the Divx encoding settings. The resulting output of a few tries was fuzzy-ish looking on my Dash, with a filesize around 2.5 megs.

Super Video Encoder: Tried with Divx and MP4, 384 bitrate, 96kbs audio. Not so great video, especially considering the 1 minute sample was the largest of them all at just over 4 megs.

Nero Vision: Used the mobile (MP4) settings with a 350 bitrate. The file size came in at just under 3 megs and the video quality was awful -- worst of any of them. Viewed at fullscreen you could barely make out what was playing -- I only knew cause I've seen the same video clip 20 zillion times by now.

ULEAD VideoStudio 10 Plus: MP4, 350 video bitrate, 96kbs audio. WOW... this one blew the rest out of the water. By far the best video quality and the smallest file size, 1.5 megs. The program is very easy to work with, settings for mobile output are built in and easily modified. User interface is excellent -- reasonably priced and definitely worth a peek. I already had it, but didn't think to try it for mobile video -- who knew it was built in. Whatever they're using for MP4 codecs work much better than the others I tried. There are 2 versions of the product, regular and 'Plus' -- the Plus version is required for MP4 encoding. The regular version allows for Divx encoding, but the file sizes were considerably larger and the video quality not nearly as good. I completely encoded the hour long video the 1 minute sample came from -- 150 megs -- not bad -- can fit a good amount of viewing on my 2 gig microSD card :rolleyes:

Edited by chaznet
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  • 3 weeks later...
Guest rukawa11
Thanks everyone -- time consuming tinkering. I've tried pretty much everything here, and have found the best solution (so far) to be nothing mentioned. For testing, I did a 1 minute slice of a video. Frames were 15fps; video bitrate in the mid-300 range; and audio at 96kbs; dimensions 320x240.

Pocket Divx Encoder & Lathe: must've been made for monitors of a different resolution than my laptop -- couldn't click the buttons, select options, etc -- nothing lined up correctly on the program itself, never could get it to do anything so I purchased the commercial version for $5: Lathe. Same thing, not formatted for all screen sizes so none of the selections lined up properly, though I was able to get it going somehow and found my way to the Divx encoding settings. The resulting output of a few tries was fuzzy-ish looking on my Dash, with a filesize around 2.5 megs.

Super Video Encoder: Tried with Divx and MP4, 384 bitrate, 96kbs audio. Not so great video, especially considering the 1 minute sample was the largest of them all at just over 4 megs.

Nero Vision: Used the mobile (MP4) settings with a 350 bitrate. The file size came in at just under 3 megs and the video quality was awful -- worst of any of them. Viewed at fullscreen you could barely make out what was playing -- I only knew cause I've seen the same video clip 20 zillion times by now.

ULEAD VideoStudio 10 Plus: MP4, 350 video bitrate, 96kbs audio. WOW... this one blew the rest out of the water. By far the best video quality and the smallest file size, 1.5 megs. The program is very easy to work with, settings for mobile output are built in and easily modified. User interface is excellent -- reasonably priced and definitely worth a peek. I already had it, but didn't think to try it for mobile video -- who knew it was built in. Whatever they're using for MP4 codecs work much better than the others I tried. There are 2 versions of the product, regular and 'Plus' -- the Plus version is required for MP4 encoding. The regular version allows for Divx encoding, but the file sizes were considerably larger and the video quality not nearly as good. I completely encoded the hour long video the 1 minute sample came from -- 150 megs -- not bad -- can fit a good amount of viewing on my 2 gig microSD card :)

i do have plus and when i click create video file, it has option mp4 psp, mp4 ipod, mp4 pda, but none of them have ur options of 30 frames per second 350kb video and 96 audio. the ipod video is 720kb and audio is 128, same with mp4 psp, and mp4 pda any ideas? there is an option for 320x240 with 15 fps but its for wmv pocket pc mode. is this the version u used? not mp4

Edited by rukawa11
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Guest chaznet

Check out the ULEAD support area for your product: http://www.ulead.com.tw/ulead/member/membe...re=PR&FS=us

i do have plus and when i click create video file, it has option mp4 psp, mp4 ipod, mp4 pda, but none of them have ur options of 350kb video and 96 audio. the ipod video is 720kb and audio is 128, same with mp4 psp, and mp4 pda any ideas?
Edited by chaznet
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Guest rukawa11
Don't used the pre-defined mobile settings, for some reason these can't be changed. You need to opt for a MP4 file and set everything manually.

when i opt for a mp4 file, some things are greyed out and wont let me change, like user defined is greyed out so i cant change it to 320 240, others are greyed out also. am i going through the wrong step? do i have to choose avi, and then choose xvid mpeg 4 codec, or h264? and also which audio do i choose mpeg audio layer 3 at 44100hz and 96kbps, or ac-3 acm codec at 44100hz and 96kpbs, mono or stereo and does the hz need to be that high. thx

Edited by rukawa11
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Guest chaznet

You should check out the support offerings at the ULEAD web site, http://www.ulead.com.tw/ulead/member/membe...re=PR&FS=us

when i opt for a mp4 file, some things are greyed out and wont let me change, like user defined is greyed out so i cant change it to 320 240, others are greyed out also. am i going through the wrong step? do i have to choose avi, and then choose xvid mpeg 4 codec, or h264? and also which audio do i choose mpeg audio layer 3 at 44100hz and 96kbps, or ac-3 acm codec at 44100hz and 96kpbs, mono or stereo and does the hz need to be that high. thx
Edited by chaznet
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Guest chaznet

Right... Once you purchase the product, you register -- after which you have access to support. The link is of little use unless you own the software.

I was curious about video encoding best suited for mobile use, which is why I started the topic.

Specifics on how to use the products are better handled by the manufacturer -- ULEAD has great support.

chaznet you need to be a registered member to use the link above :)
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the best video quality at the smallest file size would have to be XviD 2 pass encoding, at 120kbps, mp3 48khz mono at 64kbps (56kbps if the program aloows it, but u may have to drop the sample rate down to 44.1khz). a 320 x 240, 4:3 aspect ratio, 20min video comes out at 30megs. beieve me, mp4, 3gp, and divx, do not compare with XviD's great quality at such a small file size. when configuring the XviD codec, i would select AS @ L3 for the "Profile @ Level". no choppiness at all unless the source of video your encoding does it. other than that, you wont regret it. now only if the Dash's processor was stronger so it wouldnt take so long to play an acc+ file. that would be a good combination of audio/video, xvid with acc+ for mobile devices.

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Guest chaznet

Sounds impressive -- what software do you use to encode with? Don't recall xVid as an option in the Ulead software...

the best video quality at the smallest file size would have to be XviD 2 pass encoding, at 120kbps, mp3 48khz mono at 64kbps (56kbps if the program aloows it, but u may have to drop the sample rate down to 44.1khz). a 320 x 240, 4:3 aspect ratio, 20min video comes out at 30megs. beieve me, mp4, 3gp, and divx, do not compare with XviD's great quality at such a small file size. when configuring the XviD codec, i would select AS @ L3 for the "Profile @ Level". no choppiness at all unless the source of video your encoding does it. other than that, you wont regret it. now only if the Dash's processor was stronger so it wouldnt take so long to play an acc+ file. that would be a good combination of audio/video, xvid with acc+ for mobile devices.
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i use AVS Video Converter. or u can try Gordian Knot but its a bit more complex to use. the advantage to Gordian Knot is that it will do a 2 pass encoding automatically unlike AVS, u have to wait till the 1st pass is done then manually start the 2nd. i'd rather use AVS since i usually just encode tv shows to my Dash and they are around 20mins each and takes a total of about 15mins to encode on my system. Also Gordian Knot will aslo let u choose a custom bitrate setting for mp3.

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oh yea i forgot to mention the FPS when encoding, keep it at original. and also AVS Video Converter is not free. i believe it leaves a watermark but im not too sure. when just using the trial version. but of course if ur one of those people that like to download pirated software, u can get it free. dont they just make u sick?!!! Gordian Knot is free though and has more of the advantages. have fun

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Guest chaznet

Took a look -- nice program, lots of options. For me, the ULEAD solution is easier to use, and does the job well -- nice to have choices though, and AVS looks like a good one.

oh yea i forgot to mention the FPS when encoding, keep it at original. and also AVS Video Converter is not free. i believe it leaves a watermark but im not too sure. when just using the trial version. but of course if ur one of those people that like to download pirated software, u can get it free. dont they just make u sick?!!! Gordian Knot is free though and has more of the advantages. have fun
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Guest chaznet

I'm not aware of a limitation in this area, I think it more depends on the amount of space you're willing to devote to video. 15fps creates a much smaller file size, and looks fine on my dash -- I think the higher frame rates would be more noticeable on a larger screen.

Is the Dash capable of playing an mpeg4 encoded video at 29.95 or 25 fps?
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Is the Dash capable of playing an mpeg4 encoded video at 29.95 or 25 fps?

Sort of. I've loaded some 320x240 high data rate MP4s spots at 30 fps. They stutter and run at about 2 fps. You want to custom compress to a low frame rate for the Dash.

-Rob

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Is the Dash capable of playing an mpeg4 encoded video at 29.95 or 25 fps?

the XviD codec is based on mp4. i've encoded a video @ 30fps. plays with no skips or glitches. i've re-encoded some tv shows to my dash and the original fps is at 23fps even with movies. they play just fine with no kind of delays, skips, or glitches. XviD is superior to other video codecs because of its high quality at such a small file size. you'll notice when using a file search program, you'll find tv shows, movies, and hi def shows, are encoded with XviD. i had re-encoded the movie Matrix part 1 which is in hi def. and the action scenes moved smoothly with no problem. im tell you all, all these other codecs suck for some odd reason. once u get familiar with the XviD codec, u'll end up encoding all ur videos using XviD. ur call. laters

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Guest chaznet

Is xVid better than MP4...? If so, why...?

the XviD codec is based on mp4. i've encoded a video @ 30fps. plays with no skips or glitches. i've re-encoded some tv shows to my dash and the original fps is at 23fps even with movies. they play just fine with no kind of delays, skips, or glitches. XviD is superior to other video codecs because of its high quality at such a small file size. you'll notice when using a file search program, you'll find tv shows, movies, and hi def shows, are encoded with XviD. i had re-encoded the movie Matrix part 1 which is in hi def. and the action scenes moved smoothly with no problem. im tell you all, all these other codecs suck for some odd reason. once u get familiar with the XviD codec, u'll end up encoding all ur videos using XviD. ur call. laters
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ha ha... i wouldnt be able to explain why or how its better. i've read about it like a year ago. i cant remember how it does its encoding. i know just from my own experiences encoding video. oh and to answer ur question about being better. i say yes comparing qualities with both codecs, same video, same bitrate. of course XviD gets my vote.

Edited by NaW7iG
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Guest Jason Coleman
Is xVid better than MP4...? If so, why...?

Sorry, my earlier question wasn't so much a question of if there was a technical limitation, I'm very familiar with video encoding, it was one of processing power. I've since found the answer out myself with some test encodes.

The short as I can make it answer:

Xvid is an implementation of part 2 of the mpeg4 standards. DivX is also an implementation of this. The original DivX codecs from back in the day are hacked out of the Microsoft implementations of it, before they decided to really pursue their own codecs in the form of WMV.

The part 2 becomes important because recently(about the last year) mpeg4 part 10, aka H.264 aka AVC(Advanced Video Coding) have also come on the scene. In theory, AVC should actually be much better for small screen low bitrate applications such as in a smartphone, but the trade off is that AVC is very cpu intensive on both ends(the encode and the decode stage). It'll be interesting to see/find out if there's an implementation of an H.264 decoder available for the Dash and if the Dash has sufficient power to handle it.

So, the question you asked is actually non-sensical since Xvid IS mpeg4. It's for this reason that you should be able to install the Xvid codec, and use it to play back a video encoded with DivX.

The other area where things get interesting, and I may have to just try some test encodes and figure it out myself, is that Xvid supports a couple of advanced features intended to help bring the bit rate down, potentially a lot, but again at the expense of cpu power. Those 2 features, GMC(Global Motion Compensation) and QPEL(Quarter Pixel support) can improve quality and bring a bitrate down, but they aren't always implemented, and the cpu requirements may be too much for the Dash's modest CPU to accomodate. Does anyone know off hand if support for them is implemented on the dash(I think I've got a ffmpeg based codec installed) and if it has enough power to handle them on a decode?

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