Apple iPhone coming to O2 UK on the 9th of November

[Guest WoD]

Remember, remember the, uh, 9th of November for celebration, geek talk and plot. The iPhone's release, and I'm sure you'll agree, will hurt Britain's wallets a lot.

Yep. It's official. The iPhone is coming to the very provider I've just abandoned in favour of T-Mobile (O2 if you didn't read the title) and it's coming in time for Christmas.

O2 UK are exclusively offering the iPhone starting the 9th of November and available on a very limited range of somewhat pricey tariffs. But if you're an Apple fanatic and iPhone early adopter that's not going to worry you one bit, is it?

Moving on to the nitty-gritty the available tariffs will be unimaginably titled O2 iPhone £35, O2 iPhone £45 and O2 iPhone £55. These offer between 200 and 1200 inclusive minutes, 200-500 inclusive texts, unlimited data (yes, you read that correctly... kind of necessary for the iPhone) with a fair usage policy caveat, free voicemail and "special roaming rates with ITS" which I'd wager are still going to burn a hole in your pocket. The iPhone itself will still set you back a whopping £269 on these pricey contracts which are more than likely to be 18 - 24 months, a far cry from the price of most HTC devices.

The iPhone will be available at Apple Stores, Carphone Warehouse and O2 stores both brick 'n' mortar and online; there's a limit of two per customer to keep the ebay-o-holics to a minimum.

Apple's reasons for going with O2 cite the usual PR mumbo jumbo of shared company values, good coverage and customer service and high customer satisfaction levels. Some of this may be true, but I'm thinking perhaps O2 were the only UK phone provider willing to hand over a large chunk of their profits to get the iPhone onboard.

If you want to find out more, or relentlessly refresh a product web page until November then you can visit the O2 iPhone page or Apple's very own iPhone page.

And, yes, I'm as tired of all this iPhone news as everyone else.

[Guest proindigo]

WOOT can I be first to

Pay 300 bucks for a phone with less features than my 1 year old tytn (admitedly with MUCH better interface)

Pay 35 bucks per month for (no joke) 200 minutes talk time and 200 text messages)

unlimited (but secretly limited ) data plan

Wait for generation 2 people coming next year... or wait till end of next year for microsoft to bring out a pretty good copy that crashes all the time.....

If I was apple I would put a GPS in, put 3g, HSDPA in, and allow full sync with outlook, plus add a better quality camera and let tmobile sell it here in the uk

Bang there you have it ladies and gents, a real dream phone.

[Guest WoD]

It's Apple we're talking about here, we're on the 6th Generation of iPods and they still don't even make a real mp3 player by most peoples standards. I'm one of the many who went iPod, though, and I don't regret it.

iPod touch and iPhone are, in my opinion, a very large and very cruel practical joke played on a lot of consumers some of who should know better.

Take the iPod Touch, it's a device that makes changing a track so unnecessarily fiddley that as a result people might get killed when they pay more attention to the shiny screen than they do the road. With the iPod I can one-handedly adjust the volume, play/pause and change tracks through my OPAQUE standard slip case without even an inline remote.

Then the iPhone is to phones what the iPod touch is to iPods. The most simple button-clicking operations now become reliant on the touch screen and where competing and CHEAPER devices have a QWERTY keyboard the iPhone asks you to abandon all tactile feedback and squeeze your thumbs onto a couple of inches of finger-print magnet screen to type anything.

I'm not getting the appeal here...

[Guest chucky.egg]

Engadget are reporting 1400 pages per day would break the Fair Usage limit. I don't know how much that is in Mb, but if you have that much spare time I'm jealous.

10:24 - Q: What's the contract length, and does unlimited usage truly mean unlimited?

Matthew: "18 months contract. There is a limit: 1,400 internet pages per day would break the deal as part of fair usage agreement." Wait, what?

Source

As for the iPhone itself. I really don't think I care any more. I won't get one (at that price? you're kidding right?) but I don't have anything against it. I doubt many WM or Symbian users will defect, but people with the Nokia/Moto/Samsung MP3 phones might.

[Guest shadamehr]

I'm genuinely NOT seeking to promote my blog here, honest.

But I did spend this morning writing what I personally think (well I would, I wrote it), a lengthy yet informative discourse, on the cons of the iPhone as it stands, as an EDGE and Wi-fi only device.

As such, it seems mad to repost the entire topic here, but more sense just to link to it, for those of you interested in this.

Please note I am not an Apple basher - indeed after watching some videos of the iPhone's interface today, it genuinely does have some truly amazing interface touches and features.

But EDGE only... nah, no way, not today, not any day.

And given that O2 thought EDGE so Yesteryear until the iPhone tie-up, they are miles behind with an EDGE network - so much so that AT LAUNCH, nearly two months away still, they will even then only have a 30% coverage of a Yesteryear technology that is slow anyway.

And to think it takes a minimum £899 of your hard earned, to take advantage of that too.

Feel free to read my own Blog post for more info on the EDGE coverage issues etc.

It's HERE

[Guest mikeeey]

i feel sorry for the people in the UK that will be tricked into buying this phone, thinking it's the greatest device ever..atleast...thats how it was in America.

[Guest xorangefirex]

i feel sorry for the people in the UK that will be tricked into buying this phone, thinking it's the greatest device ever..atleast...thats how it was in America.

If they spend half as much as they did here in the US on promoting this phone it will probably be just as overly anticipated in the UK sadly. I just hope that with the abundance of tech-savvy people in the UK (as opposed to the US where it seems only the mentally challenged are allowed to choose our phones) will realize what a mild piece of over-priced trash the iPhone is. And as usual I feel bad for the UK as they are getting the iPhone (the same iPhone) at a hefty markup (around 140 USD by my calculations (about 70 GBP)) on a two year contract. I actually had the phone for a short period of time and found it so basic that I had to take it back, so sadly...I speak from experiance. Also, if O2 ends up similarly to how AT&T did here in the states the phone will not be able to be used by people who have a business account (aka anyone whos business pays for the account or if you use your own businesses name as opposed to your own). For some unknown reason apple has a problem with not having every person's name who owns and iPhone. It really is sad that the world (or at least Americans) can be duped with pure eye candy and slick marketing techniques. My hat's off to whoever apple highers for their advertising. Fantastic work!

[Guest mikeeey]

If they spend half as much as they did here in the US on promoting this phone it will probably be just as overly anticipated in the UK sadly. I just hope that with the abundance of tech-savvy people in the UK (as opposed to the US where it seems only the mentally challenged are allowed to choose our phones) will realize what a mild piece of over-priced trash the iPhone is. And as usual I feel bad for the UK as they are getting the iPhone (the same iPhone) at a hefty markup (around 140 USD by my calculations (about 70 GBP)) on a two year contract. I actually had the phone for a short period of time and found it so basic that I had to take it back, so sadly...I speak from experiance. Also, if O2 ends up similarly to how AT&T did here in the states the phone will not be able to be used by people who have a business account (aka anyone whos business pays for the account or if you use your own businesses name as opposed to your own). For some unknown reason apple has a problem with not having every person's name who owns and iPhone. It really is sad that the world (or at least Americans) can be duped with pure eye candy and slick marketing techniques. My hat's off to whoever apple highers for their advertising. Fantastic work!

too basic! i like that! it is just like any phone out there now, the only thing that makes it "unique" is the touchscreen, otherwise, everything else it does is just the software.

[Guest kl1wdr]

I got a confession to make:

I ordered myself an 8GB iPhone

While I understand some of your concerns I have to disagree with others. How many of you have actually had a play with an iPhone yet? I had and I gotta tell you that the "user experience" is far ahead of ANY windows mobile device!!

Don't get me wrong, I am still in the windows mobile camp but GUI-wise Apple really set the marks. While I personally don't see the sense of GoogleMaps without GPS, or being able to see the latest Stocks I love to have a FULL iPod with the so much beloved CoverFlow-Interface.

I personally DO NOT need push e-mail (too expensive in Switzerland anyway!) and UMTS (same over-the-top prices). All I need is a phone which is easy to use, has an eye-candy-interface, does phonecalls and takes care of my contacts, messages and appointments. Additional features like the - if you ask me - very first USABLE browser in a mobile device (don't tell me PocketIE is the same) and the 8GB flash memory in combination with the iPod make the device even more attractive.

The iPhone can fully live up to MY expectations (only GPS is missing for me and some more storage is ALWAYS welcome, ain't it? :wub:

I heard many say that they expected me to like it as I am an aesthetics junkie. ;)

But yes, I agree...it IS expensive...but, come on...since when does this prevent you from getting one? :D

[Guest chucky.egg]

You are right - the interface is great. I've played with a friends US device and loved the way it worked. But what it does "out of the box" is all it will ever really do.

For me the real killer is that the keyboard is awkward, and QWERTY is now a requirement for me.

I DO need Push Email and 3G is nice (not essential by any means)

There's plenty for MS (and others) to learn from, but this is "just" a consumer phone. Not the sort of device I need.

Expensive is one thing - my imported I600 cost about £275 SIM-free, that's not cheap in my book - but £270 for the phone PLUS at least another £630 for a contract is just a rip off. We all know it will sell, but we all also know that it's not value for money.

[Guest shadamehr]

Also, if O2 ends up similarly to how AT&T did here in the states the phone will not be able to be used by people who have a business account (aka anyone whos business pays for the account or if you use your own businesses name as opposed to your own). For some unknown reason apple has a problem with not having every person's name who owns and iPhone. It really is sad that the world (or at least Americans) can be duped with pure eye candy and slick marketing techniques. My hat's off to whoever apple highers for their advertising. Fantastic work!

CONFIRMED.

The O2 website makes it clear that it is NOT available to Business Customers, and no plans to do so, and apologies for that fact. But then goes even further, suggesting Business Customers might still want to change tariffs in order to get the phone.

Wow, that really IS desperate marketing indeed.

Edited September 19, 2007 by shadamehr

[Guest shadamehr]

I got a confession to make:

I ordered myself an 8GB iPhone

While I understand some of your concerns I have to disagree with others. How many of you have actually had a play with an iPhone yet? I had and I gotta tell you that the "user experience" is far ahead of ANY windows mobile device!!

Having seen the videos, that alone was enough for me to KNOW that the user interface is AMAZING. Truly so. But just as I say in my Blog post, it's STILL a Ferrari F50 with a 750cc Smart Car Engine, given the EDGE issue (again more in my Blog post).

Additionally, have YOU actually had a play with the iPhone yet... If so perhaps you would offer comment as to the lack of MMS/Picture Messaging it allegedly suffers. And I'm thinking something a bit more productive than "not everyone uses mms".

Even to those who can madly, and foolishly ignore that it has no 3G, as it does have the slower EDGE, so CAN still go on the net (just, at slow speeds, in only 30% of the UK by population density on launch), ask yourself is it right to have a phone that does not have certain PHONE features such as MMS?

No, the interface is amazing... but that can only paper over the cracks so to speak, so far, as to the underlying technology issues and omissions the phone possesses.

Don't get me wrong, I am still in the windows mobile camp but GUI-wise Apple really set the marks. While I personally don't see the sense of GoogleMaps without GPS, or being able to see the latest Stocks I love to have a FULL iPod with the so much beloved CoverFlow-Interface.

I don't see the sense of it either. And if you love it as an iPod, get yourself one - the iPod Touch (the same basic device without the phone features), is to launch BEFORE the iPhone itself in Europe. So it sounds to me by what you are saying, that an iPod Touch, is far more suited to what you want.

I personally DO NOT need push e-mail (too expensive in Switzerland anyway!) and UMTS (same over-the-top prices). All I need is a phone which is easy to use, has an eye-candy-interface, does phonecalls and takes care of my contacts, messages and appointments. Additional features like the - if you ask me - very first USABLE browser in a mobile device (don't tell me PocketIE is the same) and the 8GB flash memory in combination with the iPod make the device even more attractive.

Switzerland must be different to many other Europe markets then mate. Because certainly in the UK, the base Data Bearer Technology is NOT charged dependant upon what is offered... Users pay per MB, or pay for a Data Plan at a certain price. But they DO NOT pay more for UMTS than they do for GPRS, or EDGE, or HSDPA (in some respects - though T-Mobile prefer you to be on Web n Walk Pro for HSDPA).

So in the UK, if the iPhone WAS 3G, or 3.5G, then users would not pay a penny more for 1GB of HSDPA or certainly UMTS data, than they would for 1GB of GPRS or EDGE data.

So no reference to "same over the top prices" apply in the UK, nor most other countries in Europe as far as I was aware.

As for the Browser in the iPhone, it is OSS, or Open Source Safari... Yes it's brilliant, but its the very same base browser used on my 3.5G HSDPA Nokia N95, or 6120c. The difference is that on the iPhone, the screen is bigger resolution, so you can see more. But it takes five to ten times as long to load on the iPhone, as it does on my HSDPA N95, or 6120.

And I know which one of those two I prefer, bigger screen, or ten times faster load...

Additionally, I can easily connect my N95 up to my TV or monitor, and see it full screen. So that argument is put to rest.

And Finally, even though the iPhone does have that lovely large screen, as it says in my blog (and it's starting to sound too much like a plug for my blog), then what use, and what a waste, of such a great screen, when you can't even stream video to it well over EDGE.

You say the interface on the iPhone is much better than PPC. True perhaps. But "An Interface" does not a phone maketh - not really when it really comes down to it - sell phones, perhaps, but MAKE the phone, nah, not likely. Features do that. And watching all my PVR Sky+ recordings on my HTC Hermes over 3.5G HSDPA on the decent sized screen, using SlingPlayer, is just one of the myriad examples WHY the iPhone is all flash, and little feature... Certainly that's something you won't ever be able to do on your snazzy looking but feature limited iPhone.

Yes it has wi-fi... but again as that blog of mine mentions, the idea of a MOBILE device, is to have you connected, wherever you are, NOT for YOU to have to be dictated to where to go. If I am going to be dictated to as to where I go to access the net on my device, I might as well find a web cafe, and use a REAL monitor to do it.

And what use is SlingPlayer over wi-fi on the iPhone, if ever eventually possible... how does that help my partner who was in hospital for three days last week, and could watch all her tv on her phone, without paying the extortionate fees for in the in room tv service.

Wi-fi would not have been much use to her now would it.

The iPhone can fully live up to MY expectations (only GPS is missing for me and some more storage is ALWAYS welcome, ain't it? :wub:

I heard many say that they expected me to like it as I am an aesthetics junkie. ;)

But yes, I agree...it IS expensive...but, come on...since when does this prevent you from getting one? :D

The iPhone will live up to a LOT of people's expectations, not just your own mate - many more will be happy with its limited features.

The point is, those people clearly only have a specific or limited set of expectations.

And whilst normally there would be nothing wrong with this (horses for courses, as we say), in all past cases, if you only require a certain limit or level of features in a device, that device therefore has not cost you very much.

Those happy with the limited features of the iPhone will be paying a UK premium of AT LEAST £899 for that limited feature set though.

Finally, whilst my comments are spoken as if to you yourself, rest assured, they are actually aimed at Apple as it were, and you are merely a platform for me to point out these things - rest assured I have absolutely no gripe with yourself over this.

Finally, for those interested in any aspects of what I raise above, my Blog Post about this is > HERE

[Guest Kallisti]

3G Vs. EDGE: I almost always have HSDPA/UTMS/whateverthehellitscalled turned off on my Vario II. It sucks battery life at an unacceptable rate. Mind you, because Pocket IE is so awful, I'm a little restricted as to what I can view anyway, so I guess 3G just doesn't do it for me.

Apple Vs. Rest of the world = nil all

Push email/business features: Yes, ball dropped here. Though personally I expect Apple to have these on the phone sooner rather than later.

A:ROW = 0:1

Visual Voice Mail: WHY OH WHY hasn't someone thought of this before. I don't know about anyone else, but pressing keys to sift through voice menus for my voice mail is a complete pain in the ass.

A:ROW = 1:1

Expense: OK, this is an odd one - it doesn't seem much different to me (Eg, Kaiser is over 240 on similar priced tariffs and that's WITHOUT the free WiFi and data). Why do people think it's soo bad? I guess it's problem is that it may not be making it to the general re-sellers to allow them to make ever more narrow profit margins.

A:ROW = 1:1

Interface: Apart from it's actual features, the killer app for me is the pure fluidity and speed of response. Apple just 'got it right' on this one. You do something on the screen and it happens instantly. No clock timers, no juddering, it just does it.

A:ROW = 2:1

MMS: I honestly didn't know anyone used it. I've never received one.

A:ROW =2:1

Stupid design faults: OK, it's stupid to have a non-replaceable battery. Mind you, I've never replaced a battery on one of my phones before either. I guess this is Apple trying to dictate an End Of Life for the devices in about 3 years (it won't be worthwhile to pay to have the battery replaced). I do think they should be hung drawn and quartered on environmental grounds though.

A:ROW = 2:2

All in all, I don't get the bashers and I don't get those who are hyping it. I do think it's new and innovative, I think they've made some sensible design decisions (battery life over 3G, especially given their ipod experiences), but also some silly ones (battery accessibility). But other than that, it's one of the most stylish phones you can buy and it's a step forward in reducing the number of devices people feel the need to carry with them.

I won't be buying one now, but if push email and full exchange sync comes to the party, I'll certainly consider one.

[Guest chucky.egg]

I tend to agree with Kallisti on this

3G does drain your battery, and for my requirements (and I suspect many others too) GPRS is adequate. I don't dock Apple any points for that.

MMS? Nobody, but nobody uses MMS! If you're docking points for that you should dock points for no EMS either.

Somebody really should write a blog about this stuff...

[Guest Rob.P]

See this is why I like this site, a reasoned discussion on the iPhone. I'm no Apple lover (use'em for work along with PC's) but I'm an Apple status symbol hater, which is much of what the marketing is based on.

As a phone I do think Apple have definitely hit the nail on the head with the interface, but missed a few tricks elsewhere. Some of the tricks they have missed are only due to what I'm used to with my device and 3G is one of them, I rely it on it a lot now that I have used it. Some of the other tricks just smack of a company that's just started in the phone business, they will come with time, 2nd or 3rd gen of the iPhone will probably be v.smart and slightly less locked down (installing 3rd party apps and such like).

At the present time though, I'd rather go for an iTouch and save myself nigh on £700 (when you take into account the tariff and such like).

Last point being I hope this doesn't backfire for O2 as it looks like a rather desperate deal on their part and they have conceded a lot in terms of contracts. Orange refused the iPhone due to the contract Apple was negotiating.

[Guest shadamehr]

I like a reasoned debate mate, but some of the things you state below , you have just blatantly discounted relevant facts - let me explain...

3G Vs. EDGE: I almost always have HSDPA/UTMS/whateverthehellitscalled turned off on my Vario II. It sucks battery life at an unacceptable rate. Mind you, because Pocket IE is so awful, I'm a little restricted as to what I can view anyway, so I guess 3G just doesn't do it for me.

Apple Vs. Rest of the world = nil all

You sound life Steve Jobs on this one mate, with his excuse why we don't have 3G in the iPhone, as it would affect the battery life too much.

But that's a nonsensical excuse when really thought about, as at the end of the day it's up to Apple to sort out the battery. And even then, being fair to them, Nokia were not really able to do anything with the battery of the N95, which we ALL know is poor. HOWEVER exactly like you say, i can if I wish, elect to TURN off 3G and GPS and Wi-fi, or any combination of these I like, on my N95, and get far better battery, saving certain times only for periods I might need one of these things.

The difference here - I have a CHOICE, and can use them as and when I like. The iPhone has no choice on these.

(I can also install far better browsers on the device than IE, which everyone knows is poor, BTW to also help redress that point you made)

So I am sorry, but being more honest, I score that one as follows:

A:ROW = 0:1

Push email/business features: Yes, ball dropped here. Though personally I expect Apple to have these on the phone sooner rather than later.

A:ROW = 0:1

At least you score it honestly, but you also forget something else - if they DO ever add this, don't forget BUSINESS users can't even have an iPhone, unless they are the specific named individual, AND forgo a Business Tariff too. Apple have not allowed O2 UK to offer the iPhone to anyone not individually identifiable, for some weird reason well talked about elsewhere, nor have O2 allowed them on Business Tariffs etc.

So I score this not only a 1 for push email to the ROW, but another 1 to ROW for anyone being able to use their none apple business phones on business accounts etc.

So with the amended score from item 1 about the CHOICE of 3G, which a user can turn on or off, exactly like you mention yourself, then the current score in my book is now:

A:ROW = 0:3

Visual Voice Mail: WHY OH WHY hasn't someone thought of this before. I don't know about anyone else, but pressing keys to sift through voice menus for my voice mail is a complete pain in the ass.

A:ROW = 1:1

I like the idea of this too, if the UK nets can support it, as I suspect O2 are going to have teething problems rolling this out so quick to adhere to Apples standards. Nevertheless, kudos to Apple, point to them

A:ROW = 1:3

Expense: OK, this is an odd one - it doesn't seem much different to me (Eg, Kaiser is over 240 on similar priced tariffs and that's WITHOUT the free WiFi and data). Why do people think it's soo bad? I guess it's problem is that it may not be making it to the general re-sellers to allow them to make ever more narrow profit margins.

A:ROW = 1:1

Except on tariffs of £35 a month as the Apple iPhone will be, I don't know where you are getting the figure of £240 from for the CHEAPEST contract based Kaiser mate. Sure SOME might be charging as high. But it only takes ONE place to sell it much cheaper, and your argument then holds no sway.

And as I have already, in just five seconds Googleing, found a site doing it from FREE dependant on contract (and certainly on a £55 a month one, like the Apple iPhone is still £269 on), then this point is completely false.

Example Tariff Deal Link

The Kaiser can be had for FREE on roughly equivalent monthly cost tariffs, and can also be bought SIM free from £399. The iPhone CANNOT be bought SIM free, and thus £899 really is the minimum total price you can acquire one for, irrespective of whether this gets you included service or not - the point is you don't even HAVE a choice. Additionally, it has been hinted that come 9th Nov and the new O2 tariffs, OTHER users with OTHER devices, can elect to take out this tariff that includes free wi-fi too, with OTHER devices. Thus if it proves true, means that the Kaiser etc could easily be used on said same tariff.

So you are really NOT understanding the price issue of the iPhone here it sounds mate. in the UK, as I am not sure where you are at, the cost of a handset at £269 AND with an OBLIGATORY 18 month contract, is unheard of, and extremely pricey.

A:ROW = 1:4

Interface: Apart from it's actual features, the killer app for me is the pure fluidity and speed of response. Apple just 'got it right' on this one. You do something on the screen and it happens instantly. No clock timers, no juddering, it just does it.

A:ROW = 2:1

As already stated, I like the interface. I even like the keyboard and it's intelligent learning features, even though most other people slate the lack of real qwerty buttons on it. So I score this to iPhone too.

A:ROW = 2:4

MMS: I honestly didn't know anyone used it. I've never received one.

A:ROW =2:1

Many other people haven't either. But far more have (allegedly), and that's beside the point, it's MEANT to be a basic standard feature set of ANY colour screen mobile phone. Especially one that HAS a camera itself. Most other mobiles phones support MMS even if they DON'T have a camera.

So if your whole scoring regime was based solely on YOUR use, then fair enough, but as I feel it was actually meant as a general comparison, then whether you personally use MMS or not, is entirely not the issue. Having a state of the art (supposedly) phone with camera and beautiful colour screen that DOES NOT support MMS is absolutely incredible.

And as we are talking about the EUROPEAN introduction of the iPhone, then in Europe LOTS more people use MMS than the USA know about or bother with.

So this one, despite your simple dismissal, as outlined by me at the start, is a clear point DROPPED by the iPhone, and it's incredible "No MMS" feature. And to think - the screen just begs to be used to show off photos friends and family elsewhere send you.

And as it's a fairly accepted convention in the UK that apart for the really good new 3.2 MP and 5MP Carl Zeiss and SE lenses with Xenon flash, a camera on a cameraphone is otherwise only ever suited to taking photos to be used for MMS alone, then why even HAVE a camera on the iPhone... Good as it is compared to some mobile phone cameras, it is just the same mid-range standard, suited only for MMS.

So why even have it, if you can't even send MMS?

Oh and for chucky.egg - I send LOADS each month... my gf sends quite a few, and even my 13 and 10 year old sons send the odd one or two - it was great when my 13 year old was away at RAF camp, with his Air Cadets, to see what he was up to via a picture he sent. Even my dear old Mumsy, with a basic and cheap PAYG Nokia 6070 sometimes sends me pictures of my 4 year old, when he is staying with her overnight. I seem to recall the first ever picture message I sent, was on the Nokia 7650, the first real Symbian Smartphone, all those years ago, so long have we had MMS.

Whilst I am not for one second saying I am representative of the entire MMS world, not by a long shot, I AM however saying that you are nowhere near as representative either. The UK populace DOES use MMS, don't kid yourself any different, even if you don't use it mate.

And as outlined above, it's an AMAZING thing to have, for those rare moments you receive a true gem of a picture to make you smile, while separated from someone over distance. The iPhone not having MMS support, is quite frankly, staggering, for the UK market.

(Oh, I go on holiday for two weeks, to Spain in about 6 hours from now. While over there, whilst voice and SMS will cost the usual foreign roaming premium, with T-Mobile, an MMS message, even if just used for a very very long textual message, costs me just 20p, AND comes direct out of my inclusive allowance, so actually doesn't cost anything extra at all.)

You can imagine therefore, how pleased I am going on holiday later tonight/tomorrow morning, that i do not own an Apple iPhone as my mainstay phone, which wouldn't even ALLOW me to send an MMS, and thus DICTATE that all my communication back home was via expensive sms.

And yet people will STILL try to tell me not supporting MMS is unimportant. Whatever.

So clearly...

A:ROW = 2:5

Stupid design faults: OK, it's stupid to have a non-replaceable battery. Mind you, I've never replaced a battery on one of my phones before either. I guess this is Apple trying to dictate an End Of Life for the devices in about 3 years (it won't be worthwhile to pay to have the battery replaced). I do think they should be hung drawn and quartered on environmental grounds though.

A:ROW = 2:2

I swap out my battery loads of times - it means that I can always have a spare battery on charge and if one dies because I FORGOT to top it up, I can just bang in another.

Let's not kid ourselves, even with the best will in the world, we ALL from time to time, manage to have our mobile phone die on us.

With the Apple way, your looking at some hefty downtime while you charge it up, OR the restriction of needing to be near a charging source while you use it whilst charging. Car or home fine, but out and about, no dice son!

Finally, despite what Apple imply about the battery's useful life, it's universally accepted that as good as they are, the life cycle of a battery is NOT meant to be as long as the life cycle of the actual handset, if used correctly.

For all of us lot (the ROW) we can buy a cheap battery to replace it, either genuine or third Party, if we trust them.

With Apple, no such luck.

And looking at the Nokia example recently of the BL-5C battery recall (and let's not forget how many companies have had to recall batteries of late). Touch wood, the Apple battery is GREAT. But being hypothetical yet FAIR, if perish the thought, a fault WAS discovered in future with the battery in the iPhone, then kiss bye bye to your whole device while it is sent off to be replaced.

Nokia users the world over, in the great battery debacle they supposedly just had, were no more inconvenienced than having to wait for a replacement battery to arrive, even being able to use their device in the meantime, if they so wanted to take the chance.

The real facts are, whether so far the none-user changeable battery of the Apple has been an issue for you are not, it IS a genuine issue to note, nevertheless, and DOES put it on a lower footing than the ROW You score it this way yourself too, but only on environmental grounds it sounds, not the points I indicate.

So without a shadow of a doubt score this:

A:ROW = 2:6

All in all, I don't get the bashers and I don't get those who are hyping it. I do think it's new and innovative, I think they've made some sensible design decisions (battery life over 3G, especially given their ipod experiences), but also some silly ones (battery accessibility). But other than that, it's one of the most stylish phones you can buy and it's a step forward in reducing the number of devices people feel the need to carry with them.

I won't be buying one now, but if push email and full exchange sync comes to the party, I'll certainly consider one.

I too need people to be clear. I have said unreservedly, even from just a VIDEO of its interface, that it is like no other in terms of UI - it really looks oh so sweet. Stylish??/ Absolutely. But as I have already said, looks alone a mobile device do not maketh. Nor is it even the most important number one feature.

As for reducing the number of devices you need to carry? Sure, or maybe not so sure - "PERHAPS" would be fairer. But surely so do so many more devices, even better. My N95 has GPS and built in sat-nav, or third party pro ones available such as Co-Pilot. It also has a true 5MP camera with Carl Zeiss lens. AND the same OSS browser as the iPhone, but with much faster, and thus USABLE HSDPA.

And whilst the one fair critique of the N95 is it's poor battery life, as it is user changeable, I can always use the one from my old and broken Nokia 5500 instead, which makes an ideal charger. Because the N95 battery IS user-changeable. So this workaround negates the issue of poor battery life, were you minded to raise it, when compared ot the iPhone and its fixed battery.

So my N95 can replace a whole host of devices more, than the iPhone can. So that alone cannot be the iPhone's selling point. Even the newer WM devices have bigger cameras, and built in wi-fi and GPS too. So they too can replace MORE devices, arguably, than it ever could be said the iPhone can.

You see, the point here is reality over hype... the reality is, existing devices can do the job the iPhone does, AND A WHOLE LONG LIST MORE often better, and in the case of the net, also FASTER, than the iPhone.

But they CAN'T however, do them, on a device that looks so slick, so chic, and so cool as the iPhone clearly is.

But then we come right back to where my argument started...

The iPhone looks cooler, sleeker, and more chic, than any other device, and it's interface is second to none.

But THOSE things do NOT make the phone... the features you can actually USE it for ultimately do that.

At least, they DO on a device costing a minimum of £899.

And my scoring, when taking relevant factors into account, differs from yours immensely.

My more in depth analysis scores things as:

A:ROW = 2:6

Markedly different from your own.

Edited September 19, 2007 by shadamehr

[Guest nickcornaglia]

I come to WindowsMobile sites for all of my Apple iPhone News! ;)

My brief personal opinion having held and played with one for a bit in the AT&T store...it's a really, really nice iPod with a phone in it. The user interface is really cool...but like the HTC Touch's interface, get's old really quickly.

Get an iPhone if you want an iPod with a phone in it. Stick with Windows mobile if you actually want a SMARTphone.

[Guest Ovie]

Some crazy debating going on here!

At the end of the day, it's all up to user preference, whether battery life, user interface, style etc. etc. plays a big part for you.

I used an iPhone back in an Apple store in the States, it's pretty snazzy, but I personally think that the user interface will lose its novelty after a while and become impractical. Lack of some WM features such as copy & paste will drive me crazy!

A potential though is perhaps Meizu's miniOne...

[Guest mark4130]

I send MMS's.... ;)

[Guest mikeeey]

the interface of the iphone is better, but, it's only the software. microsoft COULD make it just as good.

the iphone has no good hardware, it's pretty basic, everything is in the software.

perhaps wm7 (photon) will have a cooler interface?

[Guest sxywill2005]

How can O2 afford to pay Apple 40% you ask? The answer is simple - rip off the dumb public who would buy an iPhone in the first place.

Look at O2's iPhone tariffs (18 month contracts):

£35 p/m = 200 minutes + 200 texts + Unlimited Data

£45 p/m = 600 minutes + 500 texts + Unlimited Data

£55 p/m = 1200 minutes + 500 texts + Unlimited Data

But wait a minute, just what does unlimited data mean to O2? Well that means 1,400 web pages a day of course! But what does that translate to in MB and GB? 1,400 web pages is very, very vague indeed.

Now people wishing to join O2 today with a free handset get the following tarrifs (18 month contracts):

£35 p/m = 600 minutes + 1000 texts

£40 p/m = 800 minutes + 1000 texts

£50 p/m = 1200 minutes + 1000 texts

So you don't get the data, the package which comes closest to the iPhone £35 p/m package is the £25 one with 200 minutes + 400 texts. So effectively your paying an extra tenner for the "unlimited data" which is not good considering what T-Mobile is offering for £7.50 a month which is 1 GB stated and HSDPA download speeds. Three charge a fiver for a GB and Vodafone not so good with £7.50 for 120 MB.

But O2 do the simplicity range of tariffs for when you have bought your own handset am I correct? Just like the iDiots who will pay £269 for a locked "smartphone" which does not allow you to install what applications as you please. So really you should get that range of tariffs where for £35 p/m I get 1200 minutes and 1000 texts with no contract at all!

What worries me is how Apple has manipulated European carriers who have played up to being Apple's bitch to get more customers on to their network via the iPhone at the customers expense. Notice how different networks in different countries will be selling the iPhone. What will be interesting is will T-Mobile who is selling the iPhone in Germany start slagging of the iPhone if it feels the sales pinch because O2 have it in the UK? I think not! El Jobso would not be pleased with that at all and I am sure it will be in their contracts somewhere!

We can see Apple having an effect on other manufacturers with AT&T supposedly requesting to disable features in certain handsets or not selling them at all so that the product looks inferior next to the iPhone. I just hope that this doesn't mean the end of O2's XDA range which have served them well over the past few years.

So what is the solution to the iPhone, well I have my eyes on the T-Mobile MDA Vario III aka the HTC TyTN II or codenamed HTC Kaiser. It is a better phone with a decent 3 MP camera, QWERTY keyboard, MMS Messaging, HSDPA, inbuilt GPS, Windows Mobile with flexible support for third party applications and excellent reliability for push email. So what if it doesn't have a flashy GUI or Visual Voicemail? Oh and as for inbuilt memory, I can easy add a 4 GB Micro SD card for about £30 and 8 GB is on the way. I can guarantee you now that the Flext WnW tariffs will subsidize this excellent device and you can get a TyTN II unlocked now or wait for the Vario III which is to be launched some time soon.

I just don't get what is so special with the iPhone? It is NOT a smartphone!

[Guest sxywill2005]

Is it just me or has the XDA range been rather slow of late in the UK? We have only just started seeing the XDA Trion aka Hermes.

Orange is the same, the M3100 has been out of stock for a while now, just when will they release the HTC TyTN II or some other SPV variation?

[Guest mikeeey]

I just don't get what is so special with the iPhone? It is NOT a smartphone!

i would also like to know whats so special about motorola RAZRs!

[Guest kl1wdr]

Good day

Let me give you my feedback on some quotes of you:

You are right - the interface is great. I've played with a friends US device and loved the way it worked. But what it does "out of the box" is all it will ever really do.

Ehrm sorry, but this is not entirely true. You can, although "illegaly", already install additional apps and games onto the iPhone. Things like FTP, NES-Emulator and much more are not only wishful thinking anymore.

Yes, I agree, you have to kind of "application unlock" your phone to be able to get this things, but hey, is it not the same with a lot of software for WM-devices?

Furthermore Apple keeps pushing out FW-updates which add some features. I am sure the MMS-thingy is just a matter of time until it will be integrated. But yes, you are right...it IS a shame they skipped that in the first release. I agree that this is a very basic feature EVERY phone should have nowadays.

For me the real killer is that the keyboard is awkward, and QWERTY is now a requirement for me.

Well, yes...I partly agree with you on this. I am also a huge fan of proper "hardware-keyboards" but I still prefer the iPhone's keyboard over a PPC's SW-keyboard (I never grew to like them....not even in all these years).

There's plenty for MS (and others) to learn from, but this is "just" a consumer phone. Not the sort of device I need.

True, it is just a consumer phone....but did Apple ever claim this device to be a smartphone? I don't know....proof me wrong, but I can't recall them saying that.

Expensive is one thing - my imported I600 cost about £275 SIM-free, that's not cheap in my book - but £270 for the phone PLUS at least another £630 for a contract is just a rip off. We all know it will sell, but we all also know that it's not value for money.

I have to TOTALLY agree with you on that, BUT:

I would NEVER get this phone with a contract (NEVER, do you hear me?). I got it from ebay for US $ 450.--...without any contract...just the phone. As soon as I get it (next week) I will bypass the AT&T activation and unlock it.

Before you yell:

Yes, I know, this is not the way it should go but this is the only way to get the iPhone relatively cheap. I don't care about the hacks I have to run before I can use the phone....I kept doing these things for years now (with WM-devices).

Having seen the videos, that alone was enough for me to KNOW that the user interface is AMAZING. Truly so. But just as I say in my Blog post, it's STILL a Ferrari F50 with a 750cc Smart Car Engine, given the EDGE issue (again more in my Blog post).

True...but I PERSONALLY do NOT need internet connectivity on the road.

Additionally, have YOU actually had a play with the iPhone yet...

Yes, I indeed have had a play with it.....twice....and I had enough time to explore the device.

If so perhaps you would offer comment as to the lack of MMS/Picture Messaging it allegedly suffers. And I'm thinking something a bit more productive than "not everyone uses mms".

Well, I am sorry, but I can't help you here. As I wrote above:

"I am sure the MMS-thingy is just a matter of time until it will be integrated. But yes, you are right...it IS a shame they skipped that in the first release. I agree that this is a very basic feature EVERY phone should have nowadays."

Still, I PERSONALLY do not care but I fully agree with you that this is an absolute no-go...

Even to those who can madly, and foolishly ignore that it has no 3G, as it does have the slower EDGE, so CAN still go on the net (just, at slow speeds, in only 30% of the UK by population density on launch), ask yourself is it right to have a phone that does not have certain PHONE features such as MMS?

Look....I only use the WWW on my mobile devices, when I am on WiFi....this is how it works for me. I have not yet felt the urge to instantly having to go online when I am on the move (perhaps this comes down to myself not being on trains etc. but driving a car and working on a PC daily). I work on a PC all day and got internet connection - I work on a PC @ home and got internet connection.

When I am in the living room and want to check my e-mails, I quickly login using WiFi. Same goes for situations when I am at my GF's parents or at my own parent's house. They all got WiFi....

So basically everywhere I mostly am I got WiFi....and in the rare situations with no such connection I could easily live with having only EDGE.

But coming back to your quote:

Yes, I agree....such a device actually cries for a proper access to the WWW. No doubt about that....

And if you love it as an iPod, get yourself one - the iPod Touch (the same basic device without the phone features), is to launch BEFORE the iPhone itself in Europe. So it sounds to me by what you are saying, that an iPod Touch, is far more suited to what you want.

Nope, not at all. I do not really see the sense of an iPod Touch, sorry.

The only advantage over the iPhone is the 16GB of storage, is it not? I already got a 80GB iPod and I use it everyday in my car without any intentions to get rid of it.

I should probably mention that I am a fan of all-in-one-devices. Therefore it would make absolutely NO sense of having an iPod Touch. I'd rather have an iPhone which can do more and also has a phone built in. I want to carry ONE device which can do everything I want/need.

Switzerland must be different to many other Europe markets then mate. Because certainly in the UK, the base Data Bearer Technology is NOT charged dependant upon what is offered... Users pay per MB, or pay for a Data Plan at a certain price. But they DO NOT pay more for UMTS than they do for GPRS, or EDGE, or HSDPA (in some respects - though T-Mobile prefer you to be on Web n Walk Pro for HSDPA).

I would not say Switzerland is much different to that. I honestly don't know the latest development in this area....

All I know is that is cost too much for me....these things are nice but not important enough to spend that much money on it.

What I personally DO NOT understand is why we cannot have a REAL flatrate. In the states T-Mobile offers such a flat rate and the users can be online any time and use MSN, PushMail etc. This is how smartphones are meant to be used!!!

I would probably be one of the first to sign a contract for a flatrate and use my devices much more often in this regard.

As for the Browser in the iPhone, it is OSS, or Open Source Safari... Yes it's brilliant, but its the very same base browser used on my 3.5G HSDPA Nokia N95, or 6120c. The difference is that on the iPhone, the screen is bigger resolution, so you can see more. But it takes five to ten times as long to load on the iPhone, as it does on my HSDPA N95, or 6120.

Sorry, but I had a N95 for a few days and cannot share you impression here. For me you cannot compare the iPhone's browser with any other device's browser. As Steve correctly said: "This is how mobile internet was meant to be like!".

As I mentioned above, I am only using the browser while being on WiFi and there it does not load that slowly...;-)

But again:

Yes, I hear you....and yes, such a device should support fast data transfer....I would sign that.

Additionally, I can easily connect my N95 up to my TV or monitor, and see it full screen. So that argument is put to rest.

Sorry, not an argument anymore...see the upcoming V.1.1-Firmware of the iPhone....;-)

And Finally, even though the iPhone does have that lovely large screen, as it says in my blog (and it's starting to sound too much like a plug for my blog), then what use, and what a waste, of such a great screen, when you can't even stream video to it well over EDGE.

I FULLY agree!

You say the interface on the iPhone is much better than PPC. True perhaps. But "An Interface" does not a phone maketh - not really when it really comes down to it - sell phones, perhaps, but MAKE the phone, nah, not likely. Features do that. And watching all my PVR Sky+ recordings on my HTC Hermes over 3.5G HSDPA on the decent sized screen, using SlingPlayer, is just one of the myriad examples WHY the iPhone is all flash, and little feature... Certainly that's something you won't ever be able to do on your snazzy looking but feature limited iPhone.

Well, I only partially agree on that.

An interface does not make a phone, that's true....but it can make a lot of users buy or not buy a device. Look at the WM-devices...I think the WM-interface could be HUGELY improved!! But I also do not want to say that the iPhone-GUI is perfect. I, for example, really miss some kind of homescreen which I grew to love on WM-devices.

But then:

Remember the SPV Canary? With all its bugs and problems? Costing a LOT of money and even being bundled to a contract with Orange?

Please keep in mind that the iPhone is Apple's VERY FIRST mobilephone!!

So I agree what Rob wrote:

As a phone I do think Apple have definitely hit the nail on the head with the interface, but missed a few tricks elsewhere. Some of the tricks they have missed are only due to what I'm used to with my device and 3G is one of them, I rely it on it a lot now that I have used it. Some of the other tricks just smack of a company that's just started in the phone business, they will come with time, 2nd or 3rd gen of the iPhone will probably be v.smart and slightly less locked down (installing 3rd party apps and such like).

Yes it has wi-fi... but again as that blog of mine mentions, the idea of a MOBILE device, is to have you connected, wherever you are, NOT for YOU to have to be dictated to where to go. If I am going to be dictated to as to where I go to access the net on my device, I might as well find a web cafe, and use a REAL monitor to do it.

*sign*

And what use is SlingPlayer over wi-fi on the iPhone, if ever eventually possible... how does that help my partner who was in hospital for three days last week, and could watch all her tv on her phone, without paying the extortionate fees for in the in room tv service.

I'd like to see you doing that in Switzerland....unless you're a milionaire!!

The iPhone will live up to a LOT of people's expectations, not just your own mate - many more will be happy with its limited features.

The point is, those people clearly only have a specific or limited set of expectations.

True...just like myself. This is what I use on my Windows Mobile device:

- homescreen (developing layouts, in case you don't know ;-) )

- PIM (syncing with outlook and LOVIN' it....couldn't do without it)

- WMP (when doing the hovering @ home....and nothing more)

- makin' phone calls and sending SMS & E-Mails (basic stuff)

Pretty basic, huh? ;-)

You sound life Steve Jobs on this one mate, with his excuse why we don't have 3G in the iPhone, as it would affect the battery life too much.

[..]HOWEVER exactly like you say, i can if I wish, elect to TURN off 3G and GPS and Wi-fi, or any combination of these I like, on my N95, and get far better battery, saving certain times only for periods I might need one of these things.

The difference here - I have a CHOICE, and can use them as and when I like. The iPhone has no choice on these.

*sign*

[..] it's MEANT to be a basic standard feature set of ANY colour screen mobile phone. Especially one that HAS a camera itself. Most other mobiles phones support MMS even if they DON'T have a camera.

So if your whole scoring regime was based solely on YOUR use, then fair enough, but as I feel it was actually meant as a general comparison, then whether you personally use MMS or not, is entirely not the issue. Having a state of the art (supposedly) phone with camera and beautiful colour screen that DOES NOT support MMS is absolutely incredible.

And as we are talking about the EUROPEAN introduction of the iPhone, then in Europe LOTS more people use MMS than the USA know about or bother with.

So this one, despite your simple dismissal, as outlined by me at the start, is a clear point DROPPED by the iPhone, and it's incredible "No MMS" feature. And to think - the screen just begs to be used to show off photos friends and family elsewhere send you.

And as it's a fairly accepted convention in the UK that apart for the really good new 3.2 MP and 5MP Carl Zeiss and SE lenses with Xenon flash, a camera on a cameraphone is otherwise only ever suited to taking photos to be used for MMS alone, then why even HAVE a camera on the iPhone... Good as it is compared to some mobile phone cameras, it is just the same mid-range standard, suited only for MMS.

So why even have it, if you can't even send MMS?

*sign*

I don't need it personally but you are totally right!

At least, they DO on a device costing a minimum of £899.

Nah...go to ebay....or buy it in an Apple-shop and "jailbreak" it.

But yes, I know...this should not be part of this discussion.

Get an iPhone if you want an iPod with a phone in it. Stick with Windows mobile if you actually want a SMARTphone.

My speech, encece, my speech...;-)

...and to end my post, here is a quote of Kallisti which pretty much resembles my thoughts:

Apart from it's actual features, the killer app for me is the pure fluidity and speed of response. Apple just 'got it right' on this one. You do something on the screen and it happens instantly. No clock timers, no juddering, it just does it.

Windows Mobiles are just so....well, you know.....slow and need A LOT of hardware power!! Is this not questionable?

Sorry for quoting in a different style but my text had too many quotes (the system said), so I had to do it this way. ;)

[Guest Zim]

Very interesting topic, some good point made both ways, Its all good saying its not a smartphone it can't do this or it doesn't have that. You have to remember this is Apple's first mobile device and if you ask me its amazing, i have been using mine for about a month now and i love it. It does a few things that need to be added, but nothing a software update cant fix. Just a though the Ipone has seen 2 Software updates already in the past month sorting out issues, how many updates does an average WM device have in its life time? 3-4 maybe? With Apple controlling this phone, as apposed to the carrier it is more likely to see additional features thrown in every update. Something i think Microsoft who in my opinion has the ability man power and money to give users what they want.

I am not saying that this is the be all and end all device, i am saying its a dam good start for Apple and the rest of the mobile phone companies, Apple has introduced a new age of look to phones where UI is more of a focus then geeky functionality. Microsoft have a stable platform and have a huge developer base, this i think is a huge advantage over Apple, all Microsoft needs to focus on is pushing Windows Mobile to a whole new era of intuitive user interface [think Microsoft surface UI implemented on a mobile device - that device would rock, it will have a intuitive UI and have the underlaying Windows functionality as well.]

sorry once again going off topic [did it in another iPhone thread] but the i believe the iPhone is just a catalysis for something bigger from both the Nokia & WM camps. The next year or two will be very very interesting.

"Z"