Three TG01s in 3 weeks & Orange insists this was an isolated incident

[Guest infobull]

Hello All,

I have been reading your posts with interest.

Unfortunately, I do not have time to contribute to the individual points but have summarised all the issues that I have encountered so far. it is a bit long but I hope someone from Orange or Toshiba will take note one day and do something about it.

I was one of the first people to use an XDA in the UK in 2002 and I would classify myself as a business power user(not a tweaker or programmer) as I have been using my XDA/XDAII/XDA Stellar to run my business everyday in the past 7 years. I wasn’t that keen on the iPhone as some of the features were totally hyped up and I was also worried it would not sync properly with my Microsoft Outlook, so I moved from O2 to Orange on the launch date of the TG01. One other key factor for my move was that on the Business Solo contract, I can make free international calls to 28 countries(I believe Orange is no longer offering this benefit) which would be essential for me to run my business.

Having had three TG01s in 3 weeks, I thought the following will give you an idea of the pains that I have been going through. My third phone is a lot more stable now but the in-call quality when using the supplied wired headset is still not acceptable. I have to ask on most calls if people could hear me which is totally unacceptable for me to run a business. I do not like using a Bluetooth headset as I am always worried about excessive radiation. I believe this is either a design or manufacturing flaw. I suspect some of the phone components may not have been shielded properly from each other, and they may be causing electromagnetic interference against each other.

One thing I have noticed is that the phone becomes less stable after connecting it to the wired headset and/or Acticesync. For some reason, by connecting the headphone wire, the phone is powered up(which was not the case in all my previous XDAs). This may have an effect of interrupting the phone’s other program routines when it went into the power save mode originally.

Toshiba has two features that I thought was previously redundant, and I have since put them to good use whenever I get stuck and I recommend you switch them on as well:

1. Task Manager Activation by double tapping the back is now very useful whenever the SPB Shell bombs out. I still have to soft reset the phone eventually but you can at least toggle between different programs to make sure things are saved before resetting the phone.

2. Phone Screen Callup by shaking the phone – this is useful as the TG01 does not have physical phone buttons, and one or two of the SPB Shell screens do not give you the phone buttons as I think the program was designed for phones which have the physical phone buttons.

I almost wanted to gather enough users and bring an action against Orange for selling a poorly designed or inconsistently manufactured phone. The software was clearly not ready and they just rushed it out and we are all now doing end user testing for Toshiba. Orange has also been misleading users about their 7 day or 28 day refund/cancellation policy – see bottom of this very long table – as the Sale of Goods Act overrides a company’s own policy in not wanting to refund for goods not fit for purpose. As Orange has been promoting the TG01 in a big way since July, they have a duty to inform any potential purchasers whether the phone is fit for purpose.

I have had the benefit/misfortunate of having three phones to compare against each other to know what the performance should be like when it works. Other people ending up with just one dud phone will probably think their slow screen toggle, etc was as expected.

In conclusion, when the TG01 works, I think the screen size and the ability to use it as a more usable web browser are excellent. I have been a WinMo user for years and like the various Outlook and Office features offered. However, it is not very good as a phone – something it’s meant to have been designed for.

Please find all the major issues that I have encountered so far.

User Interface

On Phone #1: Used the useless Toshiba UI which probably caused some of the problems

On Phone #2: Disabled Toshiba UI and installed SPB Mobile Shell 3. SPB started crashing after a few days.

On Phone #3: Deliberately did not choose the Toshiba UI on first set up. Used the WinMo 6.1 UI for a few days before installing the SPB Shell. it seems to be much more stable now.

System Performance

On Phone #1: Fairly slow compared to my previous XDA Stellar.

Was crashing quite often too.

On Phone #2: Better but still could not believe it had a 1Gh processor.

On Phone #3: Much faster and more stable.

SPB Shell has crashed only 4-5 times in the past 4 weeks, and I think I have isolated it to two reasons:

Spb.exe would sometimes crash if you press the same button too quickly or if you want to exit from a deeper Calendar menu too quickly.

Solution: Try not to press the SPB buttons to quickly and always use the “TICK” button on the bottom left instead of the “OK” button on the top right or bottom right when exiting a menu. I suspect SPB sometimes does not know you have pressed the “OK” button which is a WinMo button when exiting.

Power Consumption Bug

On Phone #1: Did not notice any problems but only had the phone for 6 days before returning it.

On Phone #2: After using it for 2 weeks with satisfactory power consumption, the phone started to say it only had 10% power left when I knew it was at least 70%+ charged just before the problem.

It got worse by shutting itself down and I could only get it back on by plugging it to the adapter, it would then show 70% charged within 5 minutes.

The last straw came when it shut itself down while I was complaining to Orange Business Customer Services. I could not call them back as I don’t think anyone in the world would be cool enough to carry his mobile phone with an ADAPTER in the pocket when he goes out!

On Phone #3: I was quite happy that I had not encountered this problem for almost 4 weeks but it happened just now.

To be fair, I knew the power was below 40% before the 10% power message came up a few hours later – which I could accept.

However, the power meter showed 70% charged after 5 minutes which is not right.

Landscape/ Portrait Toggle

On Phone #1: Extremely slow, 3+ seconds on average and it did not work some of the time.

On Phone #2: Better but still sluggish at times.

On Phone #3: Very quick without encountering any problems yet.

Ring Volume

On Phone #1: Very low, almost inaudible

On Phone #2: Louder for some unknown reason

On Phone #3: Louder for some unknown reason

In Call Volume - using the phone itself

On Phone #1: Very low, almost inaudible

On Phone #2: Low

On Phone #3: Slightly louder for some unknown reason, but still low at times

In Call Volume - using the supplied wired headset

On Phone #1: Very low, almost inaudible

On Phone #2: Much Louder

On Phone #3: Deafening even set to the lowest volume!

Call Quality - using the phone itself

On Phone #1: Acceptable

On Phone #2: Reasonable

On Phone #3: Reasonable

Call Quality - using the supplied wired headset

On Phone #1: Totally unacceptable as the other side could not hear me well 90% of the time.

They all complained as if I was using a VOIP phone cutting in and out all the time with a noticeable latency.

On Phone #2: Totally unacceptable.

The other side could not hear me well 50% of the time.

I had to ask on every call if people could hear me.

They all complained as if I was using a VOIP phone cutting in and out all the time with a noticeable latency.

Orange Customer Service once told me I sounded as if I was bubbling underwater – but that’s the O2 logo! ;-)

On Phone #3: The other side cannot hear me well 30% of the time.

When it happens, they complain as if I am using a VOIP phone cutting in and out all the time.

Orange Customer Service once told me it sounded like I was doing DIY hammering in the background every 10-15 seconds.

I have to ask on most calls if people could hear me which is totally unacceptable for me to run a business.

Call Quality - using the speakerphone

On Phone #1: Totally unacceptable as the other side could not hear me well 95% of the time.

They were like VOIP calls with a latency of something like 1 second.

On Phone #2: Acceptable

On Phone #3: Acceptable

Calls get cut off Halfway through a conversation

On Phone #1: I can have full signal(4 bars) but the line would suddenly get cut off and the phone starts searching for signal even I am in a perfect reception area without moving an inch.

I am not sure if this is a phone problem or Orange network problem though.

On Phone #2: Ditto

On Phone #3: Ditto

Calls get cut off if I press the volume up button to maximum as I cannot hear the other side

On Phone #1: Calls would sometimes get cut off.

On Phone #2: Did not notice this problem.

On Phone #3: Fine for the first 3-4 weeks, but have started seeing calls getting stuck but not cut off, ie phone signal indicates I am still in a call but I can no longer hear the other side.

Supplied wired headset sometimes does not get activated if when plugged in

On Phone #1: When you plug in the wired headset halfway through a call, the phone does not recognise it. I remember this was an old XDA problem on my very first XDA 7 years ago.

The workaround is to plug the wired headset in, turn on the speakerphone and then turn it off, it will then search for any connected devices and pick up the wired headset.

On Phone #2: Ditto

On Phone #3: Ditto

Screen goes blank when a call is answered - Not a bug but annoying

On Phone #1: I have to press the Power button to call up the screen.

Once called up and if it goes blank again, then you can tap the screen to keep it up.

This is immensely annoying when you need to press different buttons when calling automated services/ switchboards.

On Phone #2: Ditto

On Phone #3: Ditto

Display of SMSs Sorted by “Received”

On Phone #1: When I get SMSs from the same person on different dates, only the lastest SMS is displayed.

When I press the latest message, all the previous SMSs are displayed which can provide a useful audit trail on all the past incoming and outgoing SMSs.

However, this logic is incorrect as I actually want to view all the messages “By Received”, just like on all the other HTC/XDA devices.

The sort logic should be by Date and Time, instead of by the latest Date and Time, then group all the SMSs from the same person together under the latest message. You cannot then look at all the previous messages sent on different dates.

On Phone #2: Ditto

On Phone #3: Ditto

Internet Explorer

On Phone #1: Would get stuck quite often.

Small font size impossible to read and the Magnified Display choice was not available.

Orange would not accept this was a fault on its own as long as one person in the world could read the tiny display.

On Phone #2: The Magnified Display was available so it solved the small font problem.

On Phone #3: The Magnified Display is available so it solved the small font problem.

Web browsing seems to be fine most of the time.

It crashes sometimes but can use the Task Manager to kill it by double tapping the phone.

Helpfulness of Orange Business Customer Services

On Phone #1: Friendly but helpless.

I wanted to cancel my contract after all the above problems but they said as I had bought the phone from the shop, I needed to go back to the shop for the 7 day refund.

On Phone #2: Ditto

On Phone #3: Ditto

Helpfulness of Orange Shop

On Phone #1: I went back to the Orange Shop in Canary Wharfbut was told the 7 day refund only applied to online purchses.

They would only exchange the phone for the SAME model within the first 28 days.

Assured me I was the only customer complaining as I might have bought a dud phone on launch date from a bad batch.

On Phone #2: Again assured me I was the only customer complaining as people on online fora talk rubbish most of the time.

The manager did not even want to talk to me as he said he could only give me a new phone but nothing else. I could complain to the head office if I wanted.

On Phone #3: Apart from the in call quality – which is vital to me to run my business – the phone has been pretty stable.

I went into the Orange Shop in Oxford St and was told the 27 London shops had sold c. 3,000 phones in the first two weeks since the August brochure came out pushing the TG01.

Believe it or not, the guy told me I was the first one complaining!

I am very surprised no one else is having major problems with the call quality – ie, to use it as a phone rather than as a gaming/multimedia machine.

Orange Customer Satisfaction Survey

On Phone #1: N/A

On Phone #2: N/A

On Phone #3: A lady called me on the 29^th day of my contract to conduct the survey and over the 30 minute survey, she could hear a hammering noise every 10-15 seconds for the first 20 minutes(I was using my wired headset but did not move an inch throughout).

She encouraged me to complain and told me the Sale of Goods Act would give customers right to return goods for a refund within 28 days if the goods were not fit for purpose.

This would override any company policies (which was also my understanding) – but this was totally disputed by the Canary Wharf branch manager.

The sad thing was that the survey was done on the 29^th Day so I am stuck with it!

Edited August 24, 2009 by infobull

[Guest Neil5459]

Hi infobull- thanks for such a comprehensive evaluation of your TG01 experiences :D

There does seem to be an issue with build variation, and maybe later samples have had the benefit of a few internal tweaks.

I've not personally had many of your issues (thankfully, as I bought mine from Ebay- though a long term Orange customer I dread to think of the difficulties I'd get trying to use Customer Services!) but I very rarely use a mobile phone for calls- its mostly data and reference work.

The Toshiba UI is absolute rubbish- the Orange one is better, but as with most users, I soon installed Spb Mobile Shell which transforms it.

The 'popping' while using the wired headset is frequently reported- maybe to do with the microUSB connector (which I find to be a real pain in the butt due to it's fiddly design!). I generally make phone calls using the normal 'up to the ear' method and haven't had any issues. I have found the headset doesn't always register as connected when playing music- sometimes it needs removing and reinserting to get the sound to the earphones.

Battery indication- yes, I've seen issues a couple of times where the meter sticks, but in general it works fine. The battery does recharge a lot faster than my previous WM devices, but it is a much smaller battery.

Stability: I have had 2 instances of the corrupt memory card issue (see other thread) needing reformatting of the card, and a hard reset both times just to be sure. Apart from that it has been exceptionally stable. SpB MS3 has only crashed once, and as you have reported this was on exiting the calendar page. I soft reset every couple of days to free memory, but have only twice in 4 weeks needed to SR due to locking up issues.

It seems that some samples are shipped with the Power Saving Settings set to Power Save which makes the device run very slowly. I can't think why Toshiba didn't use or give the option for automatic power switching; this is compounded by making the Maximum Power and Power Save settings fixed, with only one user defined Custom setting. I set this for most parameters at midway, with the autobacklight turned off, and use this as my default.

In-Call screen blanking. This was the bane of my life with the HTC Diamond, but eventually someone developed a fix to turn it off. Hopefully someone will do likewise with the TG01. This phone is even worse as without any hardware phone keys, you have to press the power button at the end of a call to check the call has disconnected, which is counter-intuitive. Once or twice I've noticed the screen come back on, on its own at the end of a call, but mostly it doesn't.

SMS Threading: This is a feature of WinMo 6.1. Again, the HTC tweakers have produced a setting to turn it off, otherwise this registry hack from XDA-Developers ought to work:

HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Inbox\Setting s\OEM\SMSInboxThreadingDisabled

DWORD

value set to 1.

You have to create the OEM folder yourself but apart from that it seems to work okay.

Internet Explorer I also find frustrating because of it's limited text size handling. I'm a big fan of Access Netfront 3.5 Concept Edition which is still a free beta version. It has much better rendering, is fast and has the ability to define/select view settings comprising text size, magnification, virtual canvas etc. Each favourite can have a view setting associated with it. It also has 5 user defined User Agent String settings making it easy to switch between mobile and desktop views.

Hopefully Toshiba/Orange will continue ROM development of this phone. Orange have stated they will supply a WM6.5 update so we can only hope that incorporates some of the fixes we have asked for!

[Guest justj]

Ok, here comes my thoughts with TG01 after 1 month of use.

In call valumne - way too low- I have problem hearing what people are saying most of the time with this phone. Unless I have my Shure E5c Sound Isolation earphone plug in.

Signal reception - not stable - Where I live has poor signal in general, but this phone's performance is really bad. I can have full signal showing on the screen in one minute and as soon as I dial a phone number or press send SMS then ,bang, no signal. WTF?? My old Asus P735 and Gsmart T600 are better then this.

Software compatibiliity - ok??. TG01 can be very stable as long as you have the right software installed. It took me whole month to figure out which software I can install and which one I have to leave it out. I have no single crash for whole week now, and am much happier with this phone.

Toshiba UI - I personally don't dislike Toshiba UI. But I wish it is more customisable. Orange UI ?? forget it. I have also tried other today ui - SPB Mobile Shell 3 is good, but it crashes from time to time(not often but it happens). ToushFlo 3d - very stable and I love it but it take too much main storage, so I have to let it go. Iphone Today - it is so pretty with all the icon I can change but crashs all the time, too bad. Now this is it - POINTUi Pro 2.1.0.6 - the previous version crashes oftern but this new release seems to be very compatiable with TG01. The UI is like that of TouchFlow(not as good but close) and there are a lot of skin and applet you can download and use for free. It makes my TG01 looks so delicious!!!!

Ergonomic Design - The position of all the buttons are all worng IMHO. I wish the stereo socket was either on the top or at the buttom, so that I can put the phone in my pocket easier. The power and valume buttom should be higher up so I won't mis-press those keys while using the phone. It should have a dedicate physical phone and end call buttons for easy phone operation.

Battery life - It's not that I think it is bad for such a small battery, it lasts 7-8 hours of semi-heavy use. But 1000mAh?? come on. Hopefully we will have a bigger battery out on the market soon.

So, all in all, my real complaints about TG01 are In call valume and signal reception, and that happens to be the most important attributes of a phone. :D

[Guest unforeseen]

Hey

just to let you guys know that the Sale of Goods Act will cover you for 6 months for manufacturing faults before YOU have to prove the fault existed when you got the phone.

I'm taking my TG01 back now and either cancelling my (rubbish) Orange contract or shortening it and probably going to get the Hero...

RoB

[Guest barny stumble]

Hey

just to let you guys know that the Sale of Goods Act will cover you for 6 months for manufacturing faults before YOU have to prove the fault existed when you got the phone.

I'm taking my TG01 back now and either cancelling my (rubbish) Orange contract or shortening it and probably going to get the Hero...

RoB

Hi all, its been a sad time for me with my TG01. For almost a month I struggled with it, but after too many corruptions and crashes, I decided to hand it back in. My operator gave me a choice of handset, and I took the HTC Hero. I can only say that I wish I had done it earlier!!! For all those that are happy with the issues on the TG01, you may be prepared to wait for an update, but I couldnt. I need to use my phone everyday, if I cant even make a phone call, let alone use my mem card (why should I carry two mem cards with me?) then its just not good enough..

It is a shame, as the phone has a lot of potential, but too many flaws at the moment. Ive seen windows 6.5, but that wont sort out the issues the phone has! Toshiba need to pull ther fingers out!!!

:D

[Guest unforeseen]

I might offer Orange a deal...

Instead of them forking out by either cancelling my contract or giving me a new Hero... I might suggest that we sit it out and wait for a bug fix, but I get it in writing that they WILL replace my phone for another if a sufficient bug fix is not found.

i DO like the specs of this phone on paper... it is just yet another rushed phone *sigh*

[Guest rooney101]

IF YOU TRY TO BLOW REALLY HARD WITH YOUR MOUTH INTO THE MICROPHONE OF THE TG01 - JUST UNDER THE HOME BUTTON AT THE BOTTOM WHERE THERE IS A LITTLE RECTANGULAR HOLE.

THIS SOLVE ALL THE PROBLEMS LISTED

BLOW CONSISTENTLY AND REPEATEDLY BETWEEN 5-10 TIMES TO CLEAN IT OUT PROPERLY.

NO MORE ISSUES