19 replies to this topic

[vinaymanro]

According to Microsoft (via PocketNow) the Windows Mobile Marketplace has 800 Apps. Yes I am not missing any zeros, its is just 800. I can't say I can see that many apps in the marketplace, only 300.

In contrast Androids App Store has close to 20,000 apps, 60% of which are free. The Apple app-store had 50,000 apps back in the summer, so that figure must have increased alot since then. Even Nokia's OviStore has more than 2000 apps, though they do not push the OviStore to all handsets (Why on earth not!!).

So why are there so few apps in the marketplace, when we have such an affluent community of developers over at xda-developers and other similar development sites?

With the IPhone, Apple got the store right, and attracted businesses to develop applications. Android is heading in the same direction. Windows Mobile is lacking, despite having a good market share in the smartphone arena.

What do you think Microsoft need to do, to attract people to submit apps to the marketplace? And I suppose the first question should really be, What should Microsoft do to attract people to use the marketplace?

[argh]

Adjust their pricing for publishing to the Marketplace. If it was free / very cheap, many more developers would publish there, although there would also be a lot of junk to filter through.

Because Apple owns their system end-to-end and gets a revenue share (constant income scaling with the number of users) from the networks, they can afford to have a cheap/free system even though they have to pay people to certify the apps. Microsoft probably don't do so well out of one-off handset charges (or possibly one-off unlimited licenses - I'm not sure how they charge), and so charge the developers directly.

[MECX]

They need to improve copy protection for a start..... then as stated above a large team would be needed to certify applications.

Microsoft never seem to put a 100% into anything in the mobile world, it just seems like a half arsed attempt at a market place --- a bit like the operating system really.

My Diamond will be my last WinMO device for a while I think.

I actually have the Nokia N900 on loan at the minute and its like a breath of fresh air, everything just works -- no slowdowns, no memory leaks, no annoying bugs.  I think I have been using Microsoft devices for too long and have forgotten what its like to have a device that just works....... it even has a Ubuntu style repository system for getting new applications ---  fantastic.

[Rado]

It's obviously the price. I've got one or two freeware apps for WinMo, but how could they expect anyone paying $99/year (or whatever the amount is) to list freeware apps? It makes sense for commercial app vendors who make profit (whether the annual subscription fee is reasonable is another question though).

So with the current terms, they can't really expect the freeware (or cheap) apps to just start appearing in the marketplace. Maybe they could add a different type of membership for those who only want to publish freeware stuff, and another (paid) for those with commercial apps?

But as someone already said, making it free would also open the door to a lot of junk apps.

Edited by Rado, 18 December 2009 - 02:51 PM.

[agent.m]

Rado, on Dec 18 2009, 14:50, said:

It's obviously the price. I've got one or two freeware apps for WinMo, but how could they expect anyone paying $99/year (or whatever the amount is) to list freeware apps? It makes sense for commercial app vendors who make profit (whether the annual subscription fee is reasonable is another question though).

So with the current terms, they can't really expect the freeware (or cheap) apps to just start appearing in the marketplace. Maybe they could add a different type of membership for those who only want to publish freeware stuff, and another (paid) for those with commercial apps?

But as someone already said, making it free would also open the door to a lot of junk apps.

There are a lot of junk apps on the marketplace already. Sorry to be frank and no offence but the quality on the marketplace is poor. I've monitored the marketplace in us and uk and its obvious the biggest selling apps are free or dirt cheap. All the "look what my phone can do" apps/games are on xda developers... simple. not even Skyfire is on the Uk marketplace...Whats that about???

I have an Ipod touch and know that the key to the appstore is that people impulse buy, £2 for Autotune?? Ok then. just for a laugh... £5 for fifa 10?? ok.. saves me buying it on xbox.

Microsoft need to listen to the consumers and give them apps that the want. the developers out there are listening. But the quality stuff isnt on the marketplace. Developers need to be able to get their apps on the marketplace and microsoft need to make an effort to make it happen. Also the good developers are starting to move to Android because its easier to code.

[Sonicr360]

I am with Agent.M Here 100%
The App Store has WELL OVER 100,000 apps now !! ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND!!!!
Yes for those wierd die hard WM geeks, not all of them are "great", but what a choice you have. Sure they will not suit anyone, but come on; Listen to what Agent.M has said, MS are complete and utter idiots!
I cannot remember who posted the so called Microsoft advert about their MarketPlace (I think it was meant to be a funny video, which was cr4p), but they are NOT LISTENING to the customers (like me) about what they want!! It is Microsoft that are ripping you lot off, with the promise of a great WM7 OS that is due out, yet what the majority of people DONT KNOW is that the MS developers are simply jumping ship for various reasons.

Sorry, but Microsoft are causing a real problem, and I for one think that with Android causing an ever greater stir in the Phone market place, they either better get their act together, or they will sink!!!

As one poster has said, Microsoft are not really putting any effort into this.......... And for those hoping WM7 is going to be the saviour..... well........ I am just not convinced! Hearing comments from the HTC Executives saying they are unhappy about MS is starting to say it all !

I have a WM 6.1 device (which is naff compared to Android and iPhone) but I am not inspired to move up a gear for 6.5 / WM7 next year. Working with developers has its advantages Working with iPhone and Android users shows just how naff WM is!

Truly is and unless you really see it for yourself, its hard to fully apprecaite where I am coming from.
Like I said, I work with developers, so its pretty cool to have the mixture of all makes of phones and brands

[mikeadams68]

Lets consider where the smartphone market has moved to ease of use in OS and number of apps for the platform.  Apple gets it, Android gets it and even Nokia is catching on.  Winmo seems to be the one in the corner scratching their heads wondering whats going on. WAKE UP! Reduce the fees charged to developers to encourage development and for goodness sake remove the restriction that apps can not be installed on the memory card.  You want to encourage consumers to buy apps but yet you restrict apps to only be installed on the limited amount of onboard memory.

[Geoneil]

Mikeadams - I think that limitation is down to your device, rather than the OS, I have an Asus P550 (branded as a Vodafone 1520) that allows me to install apps on the memory card.  

I for one have never even heard of Microsoft's Market Place, the apps I've downloaded off the net I've gotten from places like Softpedia or Modaco or from finding the developers through Google, not the most user friendly way of doing it.  Personally I think you just have to compare Pocket IE to the Webkit-based proper browsers on the competition to see that Microsoft either care far less about WinMo than they do about Windows on the desktop or XBox (as evidenced by HTC switching over from a purely WinMo manufacturer to Android) or they still see Windows Mobile based phones as a companion to the Windows based PC (I still remember searching for apps and only finding ActiveSync exe installers, no cabs, I even remember seeing a zip file reader which you could only download as a zip archive, which kinda defeated the object)

[m1k1]

As I know developers has problem to submit apps to store. I have friends and his company is not able to submit apps since August!!!
The second problem is that only developers from several countries can submit apps.

[firstandlast]

Geoneil, on Dec 20 2009, 07:18, said:

Mikeadams - I think that limitation is down to your device, rather than the OS, I have an Asus P550 (branded as a Vodafone 1520) that allows me to install apps on the memory card.  

I for one have never even heard of Microsoft's Market Place, the apps I've downloaded off the net I've gotten from places like Softpedia or Modaco or from finding the developers through Google, not the most user friendly way of doing it.

No  Geoneil I think the limitation is down to the fact that you don't know about Microsoft's Market Place!

Mikeadams is perfectly correct that at the moment when you install an application from Microsoft's Market Place, (a task you admit to never having done) it does not give you the option of installing it on the storage card and just installs it on to the device's main memory.

We all know that if you download from other sources you have the choice of installing it on the memory card.

I'm sure Mikeadams knows what he is talking about.

[Sonicr360]

Firstandlastm
I think it would have been better to post a link from MSDN about the matter, so all can read and understand this....

http://social.msdn.m...28-aceebe0a5642

I think the comments on the thread say it all ..... Microsoft really are taking you Market guys for a ride

Also, just for all of your references, some understanding into this apps store
http://msmobiles.com...s.php/8735.html
The quote I love is "Microsoft employees are extremely incompetent in the area of mobile software and Windows Marketplace for Mobile has the worst conditions for developers among all other app stores"

Says it all about MS and WM - This site needs to focus MORE on Android and iPhones, because WM is becoming very much stale in comparison.

[ad720]

I agree 100%. Not being able to install programs to other places besides the main memory makes the Marketplace practically useless, regardless of how few apps are available.

[Sonicr360]

MarketPlace and Microsoft WM is very much like old bread .... Very stale, poorly made and best to chuck and ditch it!!

[andybarker]

As I understand it, iPhone users can ONLY use the AppStore (assuming they don't Jailbreak the phone) which means that is the only legitimate option for developers and end users - so if you want to develop apps for the iPhone you have to put them in the AppStore.

For WM, you can put your apps wherever you want on the internet.  Just because the MS store has so few programs in it, doesn't mean there are few apps for the device.  I've seen plenty of the "pointless" apps available for WM devices (e.g. an app to do an impression of a pint of beer when you tilt the phone).

Don't know the terms for Android, so won't comment on that.

[Sonicr360]

Andy
Does not matter where the apps come from, fact is WM Marketplace has flaws and needs to be corrected.
iPhone having a choice of over 100k - I dont think you can go wrong there!

There are apparantly methods of installing apps outside the app store, which requires a 3rd party app - a search on google may find something more on this.

[balendra68]

 Absolutely Wrong! I have a Winmo phone, a cheapo from HTC called the P3400i. 90% of my applictions are installed on the memory card. The problem you have pointed out is with Android not WinMo.

[Sb.]

Why is everyone surprised?? Everyone knew it was going to be crap and go nowhere just like most of their products.

A lot of Windows users are only here because they hate Apple from way back and were always using windows because thats all we had to choose from and once given a chance to try something else apart from apple I believe will drift away from windows for good!

[Sonicr360]

Sb., on Jan 1 2010, 07:04, said:

Why is everyone surprised?? Everyone knew it was going to be crap and go nowhere just like most of their products.

A lot of Windows users are only here because they hate Apple from way back and were always using windows because thats all we had to choose from and once given a chance to try something else apart from apple I believe will drift away from windows for good!

AGREE ONE HUNDRED PERCENT!!!!!!!
This is the trouble, everyone hates other companies when it comes to Mobile phones.

My WM can do this..... your apple cant! Google is not safe, MS is!!!!

Well, it all comes down to individual taste. For me, MS is just letting customers down, and from what I can see, people are happy to stick with M$ !

Which is cool ..... cool to have a good app store... that .... err....... well...... OK ITS CRAP !!!!!  

[Sonicr360]

balendra68, on Dec 26 2009, 14:24, said:

 Absolutely Wrong! I have a Winmo phone, a cheapo from HTC called the P3400i. 90% of my applictions are installed on the memory card. The problem you have pointed out is with Android not WinMo.

Balendra
I think the person was saying that WM Marketstore (or whatever its now called) prevents the apps being installed on Memory cards, but you only get the option to install on the phones physical memory only.

If this has changed, please could you post a link to this for us

[NaplesBill]

All of the current App Stores only allow installation on internal memory.  This is a DRM issue for Android and RIM.  I am not familiar with WebOS though.  

If anyone remembers, the original Apple App Store was not without it's own share of issue.  It still has issues sometimes with updates to apps etc.

I have owned three iPhones, more than seven BBs and five WM phones.  I always go back to WM because I can modify just about every aspect of the device.  No other mobile device is this hackable.  Yes, you can jailbreak an iPhone and root an Android phone but you still don't have anywhere near the number of hacks available to WM phones.  

There are some things about the Market Place that are better than the others as well.  On Android you do not have a list of all downloaded apps except on the first launch after a rom flash (and not always then).  You also cannot just select install all, etc.

Also, Android has no built-in support for installing to SD at all.  You can manually install APKs but you cannot choose where to install them.  Yes, you can use Apps2SD but this is an all or nothing choice.

My point here is that none of the App Stores are perfect.  The RIM store is the worst (again, haven't used WebOS) and I personally think Market Place is better than the Android Market.  Of course, Android Market has more apps right now but their App Store is far from perfect or even great if you are like me and constantly flashing roms.  With WM I can find an app in the Market Place and if I really want to install it to SD I can most likely find it online and just install it via the CAB file to SD.