Guest sweboi Posted March 7, 2006 Report Share Posted March 7, 2006 Hey All, We have noticed that the direct-push function in AKU 2.0 does not work on orange, the problem seems to be that orange puts all devices behind a number or NAT gateways. Initially the device connects fine, if I send myself an e-mail it gets pushed to the device, all seems fine. However after about 2 minutes it stops working. After the initial 480 second timeout and the device has not heard back from the server, the device "pings" the server again, this can be seen in the log of the device if you turn logging on. If we then look in our firewalls, we can then see the connection now comes from a different IP. It seems that orange somehow randomly re-assigns the nat gateway to one of the three they seem to have if the connection has been idle for more than 2 minutes or so. Effectively this means the exchange server can not use the http-keepalive to send the sync command back to the device as the connection between the nat-proxy and the device has been disconnected by orange's network. Hence direct-push will not work. I sure hope orange are going to address this since they so proudly told everyone at 3gsm that they were in partnership with microsoft on this. You can see the error in the log ever nine minutes, as it logs PING FAILS, and then INITIATING NEW PING CYCLE. Cheers, Tobey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest datsunman Posted March 15, 2006 Report Share Posted March 15, 2006 Hey All, Cheers, Tobey <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Tobey, can't help with your specific situation but our Wizard with Direct Push works fine on Orange. Maybe something with your specific setup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Will Posted March 15, 2006 Report Share Posted March 15, 2006 Sorry to be bearer of more news, but mine is working fine.. If you want i can set a temp mailbox up for you here, and test a couple mails? PM me if you want.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest OG Posted March 15, 2006 Report Share Posted March 15, 2006 Hey All, We have noticed that the direct-push function in AKU 2.0 does not work on orange, the problem seems to be that orange puts all devices behind a number or NAT gateways. Initially the device connects fine, if I send myself an e-mail it gets pushed to the device, all seems fine. However after about 2 minutes it stops working. After the initial 480 second timeout and the device has not heard back from the server, the device "pings" the server again, this can be seen in the log of the device if you turn logging on. If we then look in our firewalls, we can then see the connection now comes from a different IP. It seems that orange somehow randomly re-assigns the nat gateway to one of the three they seem to have if the connection has been idle for more than 2 minutes or so. Effectively this means the exchange server can not use the http-keepalive to send the sync command back to the device as the connection between the nat-proxy and the device has been disconnected by orange's network. Hence direct-push will not work. I sure hope orange are going to address this since they so proudly told everyone at 3gsm that they were in partnership with microsoft on this. You can see the error in the log ever nine minutes, as it logs PING FAILS, and then INITIATING NEW PING CYCLE. Cheers, Tobey <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Tobey, GPRS sessions time out due to the lack of IP ranges available, to allow 'dormant' connections to be used by other users. IPs get reassigned after periods of inactivity, the length of which depends on the APN used (NAT'ed or PAT'ed). In AKU2, the device sends a 'heartbeat' to the server every so often to indicate it's presence and new IP (if reassigned), in order for the server to push any newly received emails. Orange should acquire new IP ranges at some point but this will not affect the push-email service, just give users more IPs. I hope this clarifies things a bit Olivier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anks Posted April 21, 2006 Report Share Posted April 21, 2006 I'm using Push E-mail on Orange UK and Tobey is 100% correct. Although the device actually functions the HTTP keep-alive is dropped and this results in excessive data usage even when no e-mails are being received. My GPRS usage per hour is about 43K due to this timeout. However on Oranage's web site here: http://www.orange.co.uk/business/corporate...e/mme.html#sgso it states Our network has also been specially configured to provide a dedicated access point on the Orange network for Windows Mobile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jimbouk Posted April 21, 2006 Report Share Posted April 21, 2006 (edited) I don't understand. I am on orange with an Imate Jamin and a hosted exchange server account and it works fine - no special arrangements needed with orange. MS developed the heartbeat directpush system due to devices constantly changing IP addresses and gateways. The system sends a 3kb datapulse every five mins (by default) to the exchange server, confirming its current Ip address and that it is online. As a result, your device should use approx 36kb per hour when direct push is on (I am not surprised that the poster above experienced 43 kb - as he probably got and email or changed an appointment during the hour). Edited April 21, 2006 by jimbouk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anks Posted April 21, 2006 Report Share Posted April 21, 2006 Just off the phone to Orange and the customer service experience was not a plesant one. I eventually got put through to someone to talk to who knew that the push e-mail service was. It is offical, Orange does not support Push E-mail correctly at the moment. They did trial this service with three customers who all had issues and it was subsequently pulled and there is no ETA for a reinstatement. Push e-mail will work with the standard APNs but you will see much higher than normal data traffic. This is annoying not least because it's quite prominent on the Orange site and they boast about being the first network to offer Microsoft's push e-mail solution. The trial I ran to prove this BTW was performed over several days on a device and mailbox which we knew the traffic to and from, it was not a case of in the last hour. I've got quite a lot of info to prove what's going on and who is at fault! I was really just trying to confirm Tobey's findings, and although it does work, it is not working correctly due to incorrect service provider configuration. For info, the comments immediately above are not correct, Exchange does not use a fixed heartbeat interval and by default the maximum is 45 minutes. In fact exchange will warn you if the average heartbeat period falls below 9 minutes, which on Oranage will be continually! See this article for more information. http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=905013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jimbouk Posted April 21, 2006 Report Share Posted April 21, 2006 (edited) For info, the comments immediately above are not correct, Exchange does not use a fixed heartbeat interval and by default the maximum is 45 minutes. In fact exchange will warn you if the average heartbeat period falls below 9 minutes, which on Oranage will be continually! See this article for more information. http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=905013 For info... Everything you have said re timings (and the page you link to above) refers to the Exchange and IIS server settings. Not the device. The device is set to send its first heartbeat within 480 seconds of starting up and every 300 seconds thereafter. It then scales the heartbeat interval up if the network conditions allow it. For clarification check your device's registry: HKCU\software\microsoft\Activesync look at the values for initial heartbeat and heartbeat increment. Edited April 21, 2006 by jimbouk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stemill Posted April 21, 2006 Report Share Posted April 21, 2006 For info... Everything you have said re timings (and the page you link to above) refers to the Exchange and IIS server settings. Not the device. The device is set to send its first heartbeat within 480 seconds of starting up and every 300 seconds thereafter. It then scales the heartbeat interval up if the network conditions allow it. For clarification check your device's registry: HKCU\software\microsoft\Activesync look at the values for initial heartbeat and heartbeat increment. Don't think you're right on this one jimbouk. According to Jason Langridge's (top windows mobile bod) blog http://blogs.msdn.com/jasonlan/archive/200.../22/454717.aspx the data usage over a month should be about 1MB, by your calculations of 36k per hour your looking at 26MB. So although push email on Orange may be working in theory it seems like it definitley working sub optimally. It sounds like the dormant GET requests are being dropped at Oranges end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jimbouk Posted April 21, 2006 Report Share Posted April 21, 2006 ;) - thats where I got some of my info from - but misread it - its 300bytes - and thus 0.3KB per pulse! (and thus 2.6mb per month)! If you read all of his comments about directpush, he confirms that data usage will be between 5mb and 12mb per month just for the pulse though - maybe he's allowing for the network vagaries! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jimbouk Posted April 21, 2006 Report Share Posted April 21, 2006 PS - I am leaving Orange for Tmobile as soon as my contracts up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest OxCrab Posted April 27, 2006 Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 I can verify that despite all of Orange UK's marketing hype, push email doesn't work! After speaking to business tech support, all current access points will release their IP address within 180 seconds idle time, so the heartbeat mechanism will never work with intervals longer than 180 seconds since the server keep alive will never reach the device. The access point specifically refered to in their marketing material to support push email isn't yet online, and the tech support guy wasn't able to give me a go-live date other than "probably within the next couple of weeks". He did say that it was being specifically set up to support inactive connections of upto 60 minutes before tearing down the IP address. Without this access point, direct push boils down to a full sync initiated by the device every 480 seconds (by default!) Bit of a mismatch here between Oranges hype machine, and the technical reality of the situation unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest creamhackered Posted April 27, 2006 Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 I can confirm this too, it's a problem with the way their APNs are currently setup and Orange have confirmed this. I have moved to T-Mobile and should have my SIM within the next few days ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest RazorD Posted April 27, 2006 Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 (edited) Well, i called Orange and was told They dont support Push Email - the only device which does is the blackberry and thats only for their buisness users.. How fun! :P Oh! And hey guys! I'm back! - With uni and the M500 i was kinda drifted from MoDaCo a bit, but now i've got my C600, i'm right back again ;) Edited April 27, 2006 by RazorD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest leoiden Posted April 27, 2006 Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 any word yet on being able to application unlock the spv c600 with the new rom?????????????????????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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