Mac VS PC

[Guest The Doctor]

After Confucious threw down the Mac VS PC gauntlet today in a topic I've decided to open up a debate about the benefits/drawbacks of both the Mac OS X and Windows OS's

As i have a Mac, i shall be fighting the Mac's corner :)

For a start, Windows is ridiculously easy to infect with a virus (accidentally or maclicously), spyware or any other of those internet beasties (my family PC is currently being repaired after becoming infected with a nasty virus) Mac OS X has no problems with viruses etc for the simple reason it is ALOT harder to infect a computer with Mac OS X than one with windows as OS X has a DECENT built in firewall and no need for AV software. Mac OS X also rarely crashes, i leave my Mac on almost 24/7 and its only crashed 7 times in the past 2 months :D If you asked a windows based PC to do that it'd fall over ;)

Secondly, Mac OS X works well :P I dont have to go hunting for drivers or updates because windows whines that one of my devices is incompatible or needs a specific driver or update or whatever. It also automatically updates shortcuts etc when you move applications around so there arent any broken shortcuts.

A Mac also looks fantastic :D none of this huge grey/black box down the side of your desk, its as if the word elegance materialised in the form of a computer on your desk, and thats just the hardware design, Mac OS X itself is also very pretty :( yes, yes your probably thinking, but vista looks vey nice too, thats because theyve take ideas from Mac OS X, such as the desktop widgets, the way pictures are displayed, and the file explorer when opening documents etc in applications.

Mac's are also alot better at managing music, films, podcasts etc than windows. The 'now showing' feature in the new intel macs is a vast improvement on the 'media centre' edition of windows XP.

A Mac also comes with some of the best software available such as iLife 06 which is absolutely fabulous :)

Finaly i leave you with some 'Get a Mac' adverts :) well worth a watch even if your a windows convert ;)

http://www.apple.com/uk/getamac/ads/

Phil

Edited November 26, 2006 by The Doctor

[Guest jimbouk]

I dont have strong feelings either way...but have to take you to task on a couple of points:

1) My sony laptop and my home built desktop and home built media centre havent "crashed" in the last three months. All are running XP and all stay on 24/7.

The only problems I have had in recent times are of my own making - namely loading Vista RC1 onto a partition on my laptop and experimenting with it. It has crashed a few times as I have played around with it. As an aside, I have stopped mucking about with it and now it is running fine and hasn't crashed for a month now.

2) I might regret saying this...but I have never had a virus on any machines - nor on any of the 200 or so machines that I look after for my clients. Some of them have had virus's before I started looking after them but they have called me in to sort it _ and once a good av software is on, no infections.

3) I have music and media which I can access anywhere on the planet, on my phone, in a web browser - I can even start watching a tv program that my media centre is recording at home, on my Hermes sat on a train (whilst its still recording it).

I think Mac's look great - but then again so do some pc's. I acknowledge that if I was a designer or a photographer I would get a mac - but in normal business - Windows is easier and there are more programs etc available.

[Guest The Doctor]

2) I might regret saying this...but I have never had a virus on any machines - nor on any of the 200 or so machines that I look after for my clients. Some of them have had virus's before I started looking after them but they have called me in to sort it _ and once a good av software is on, no infections.

I agree if good AV software IS installed then windows is alot better (not that windows defender crap), Mac OS X however doesn't exactly need AV software with its inherently secure open source UNIX base.

3) I have music and media which I can access anywhere on the planet, on my phone, in a web browser - I can even start watching a tv program that my media centre is recording at home, on my Hermes sat on a train (whilst its still recording it).

I think Mac's look great - but then again so do some pc's. I acknowledge that if I was a designer or a photographer I would get a mac - but in normal business - Windows is easier and there are more programs etc available.

Sadly that IS one of the disadvantages of a Mac, less programs are available (Orb being a notable and rather stinging example) However the ease of use of the applications on a mac is superb, installation is literally just dragging and dropping an aplication icon into your application folder in most instances. I've never really experienced a lack of programs for Mac (except for Orb and ROM editing tools etc) as i use the bundled iLife and iWork more than anything else, works alot better for me than MS Office.

Phil

[Guest mini_man]

From a windows mobile point of view.

Although Mac has the missing sync.

Active sync is the software for windows mobile and what did I hear you complaining about on msn! the lack of support for .exe desktop installers!

If it werent for the lack of decent support of windows mobile on a mac the mac would probably be quite good.

Sam

[Guest mandt]

Three months ago I bought another new PC...

although I seriously looked into switching to a Mac, what stopped me was:

my 'baggage' of Windows software, which I didn't want to lose

and the price!

I've no doubt that Macs are the better machine, I was certainly impressed with the ones I played with while 'evaluating', it's just that sometimes the inferior product wins the race (VHS vs Beta, Mega drive vs SNES, etc)

[Guest mwright]

Finaly i leave you with some 'Get a Mac' adverts :) well worth a watch even if your a windows convert :D

http://www.apple.com/uk/getamac/ads/

Phil

Hee Hee - brilliant - thanks for those

[Guest bennish]

Get a Mac - you can use it to steal peoples' flash animations!!

Get a real computer Phil and get some real talent. If you act like such a jerk again it'll be going to the moderators.

And you accuse Windows of stealing from Mac? Give us a damn break. Hypocrite

Edited November 26, 2006 by bennish

[Guest The Doctor]

Three months ago I bought another new PC...

although I seriously looked into switching to a Mac, what stopped me was:

my 'baggage' of Windows software, which I didn't want to lose

and the price!

I've no doubt that Macs are the better machine, I was certainly impressed with the ones I played with while 'evaluating', it's just that sometimes the inferior product wins the race (VHS vs Beta, Mega drive vs SNES, etc)

Mac mini's start at £399 for an intel core duo at 1.66Ghz (faster than it sounds as it is effectively 2 processors in one. both at 1.66GHz), imacs start at £679 for a 1.73Ghz Core 2 Duo with a 17" screen, built in webcam, bluetooth, wifi, mouse + keyboard, 160gb hdd and 1gb RAM :D

So its not too expensive...

As for you baggage of windows software, if you desperately needed it you would install windows (heaven forbid) on a partition on your mac hdd using bootcamp which allows the running of windows natively on mac's.

Mac's are undoubtabley superious machines for just about anything, you can configure them for what you need them for, i dont see many pc's that have the option of TWO 30" HD flat panel displays if your seriously into your home enterainment. If you need one just for work then a mac mini will be just fine. iWork is much friendlier than Microsoft Office and focuses around the more asthetic aspects of your work rather than microsfts more formal approach with office.

@mwright - yes those adverts are brilliant :)

Phil

[Guest The Doctor]

Get a Mac - you can use it to steal peoples' flash animations!!

Get a real computer Phil and get some real talent. If you act like such a jerk again it'll be going to the moderators.

And you accuse Windows of stealing from Mac? Give us a damn break. Hypocrite

Bennish, this is the lounge, I have every right to express my opinion. You of course have the right to challenge those opinions, but please don't call me a jerk. It's not nice.

If you had a problem with me using your flash animation then you could've pm'd me and asked me to remove it and i would've done so willingly.

As for talent (or rather lack of it), I'm not entirely sure where you got that notion from but at least i can express myself without resorting to threats and called others "jerk's" :)

Phil

[EDIT: bennish if you wish to continue this disagreement please do so via PM, I have no intention of filling the forum with disagreements such as this]

Edited November 26, 2006 by The Doctor

[Guest bennish]

Firstly it's jerks, not jerk's. Some grammar would really be lovely.

Would it be so hard to pm me asking permission for my signature? Why should I be the one to pm?

Yes, lack of talent, mmhmm. That's why you stole it, right? You like to steal things you don't like. How about you use iLife or iWork or iTakewhatiwant or whatever the hell you have to make something of your own?

I'm sorry but I can't help it if you act like a jerk. It's your choice.

I'll be notifying someone about this plagiarism and I'm sure they'll be in contact with you.

Edited November 26, 2006 by bennish

[Guest The Doctor]

It's jerks, not jerk's. Some grammar would really be lovely.

It's not nice? Look who's talking buddy.

Would it be so hard to pm me asking permission for my signature? Why should I be the one to pm?

Yes, lack of talent, mmhmm. That's why you stole it, right? You like to steal things you don't like. How about you use iLife or iWork or iTakewhatiwant or whatever the hell you have to make something of your own?

I'm sorry but I can't help it if you act like a jerk. It's your choice.

I'll be notifying someone about this plagiarism and I'm sure they'll be in contact with you.

bennish, as I said before I'm not taking this any further with you in this thread. Continue via PM if you feel the need.

Phil

Edited November 26, 2006 by The Doctor

[Guest Laser_iCE]

Back on topic...

I personally prefer PC's mainly because of the fact that it's what I grew up with, and probably the strongest argument of all -- the software support.

I will admit, though, for the fashion conscious, Mac's are hot, however, as a general assumption, most of the people who pick up mac's now are the ones that bought an ipod because of the cool-factor, and are now using a mac because its the "cool" thing to do (they're stylish and all great photoshop users should own one -- just what we need, more websites with crazy colours and tiny fonts).

[Guest awarner (MVP)]

As for mentioning drivers and updates etc, one of the main reasons for this is due to a hell of a lot more hardware made for the PC than the MAC, it would be nice if everyone used the same rule bok when designing a new grapics or sound card etc but that would never happen as each manufacturer want to develop the next best thing their own way.

As for system crashes, I don't remember the last time I has a system crash. The one PC I leave on 24/7 has not crashed once this year.

As for viruses, one of the main reason for this is due to availability and popularity of the systems. If the MAC became more mainstream for the home user worldwide then the threat of a virus would certainly change.

[Guest mupwangle]

I recently bought a 20" iMac after dithering for ages about buying a new PC. The Mac was about £50 more than the equivalent spec of Dell (same screen, memory, processor, graphics and HDD) There are a couple of downsides - the main one being that as the iMac is essentially a laptop, upgrading is a bit difficult and the bundled mighty mouse sucks.

Other than that I don't regret the purchase at all. From the activesync .exe POV it is a pain but you can dual-boot to Windows XP at full speed or use Parellels to run Windows (or any other OS) in a windows at slightly less than full speed and use missing sync for the rest.

Someone said earlier that macs are best for photoshop. at the moment that isn't true as the intel-based macs suck at photoshop as it has to run under PowerPC emulation (Rosetta) until Adobe rewrite it.

[Guest jimbouk]

Mac's can and do get malware.

I don't think it will be long before the inroads that Macs are making into general commerce and amongst the fashion conscious will bring them to the forefront of hackers and virus writers minds and its gonna be bad when it happens.

[Guest Alsicole]

It won't necessarily be bad. Some of us who have gone to Mac from years of PC usage have made the very sensible choice to include firewall, anti-virus, anti-spyware software on our Macs. The virus and trojan writers might not have caught up yet, but when they do, at least I'll be prepared.

[Guest rs2.pt]

I think Mac's look great - but then again so do some pc's. I acknowledge that if I was a designer or a photographer I would get a mac - but in normal business - Windows is easier and there are more programs etc available.

hi

1) ...

You say it all when you said that you build a PC. let me explain...

I am a windows develope for past 8 years, and windows/dos user almost past 12 years. I am a recent switcher to a beloved iMac, at my home. Currently, at work, I still develop on windows platforms... its my job.

As a father os 2 little kids, at home I no more have time to spend on setting up thinks on XP, updating, seeking why last wmv or divx didnt let close my kids MediaPlayer, making dvds from kids, making screen templates etc... I had a user for my 4 years hold kid, with user restriction; a user admin for me, and other for my wife...

If I had time, spend it on XP, tuning it, and using it without antivirus, since I have carefull with what I put on my machine. etc etc... all things a PC expert can do, and then yoes you have a decent PC running. Like I have on my work.

but you cant do that without risks on comun user. With a Mac you can, belive-me... A basic filosophy arround the computer is that "The computer was made too help your problems" and not "to be a problem to solve" and to do that you need to be a computer expert... this last point is where windows still relly. Yes many people uses Windows, unfortunently for many other reasons...

Today at home I found my self getting more results from my iMac thant when had my home buit PC. And hey... Aplle machines look great at home, nicely build, good looking etc... If I could (on my workplace) I put here a imac 20" running windows.

yes today Mac intel are the ultimate dev machine, you can develop for Apple, Windows, Linux... beacuse you simple can.

If my kid will be a geek will have a mac for shure. it can chose then... even for the geeks, those that are familiar with linux or unix, open a shell on Mac and voilá they are in even.

2) as I point on 1) for any computer expert its ok. as for my mom that uses a Thoshiba laptop with XP (unfortunently could get a macbook yet) she dont understand about that complex thinngs if you understand what I meant...

3) yep, true... for my XP to make DVDs for example I have to use a decent software very expensive ones. on iMac comes with included iDVD, just briliand. none of XP testes software I have so quality temples... just "a la Mac".

With Mac intel and virtualization technology you can have PC stuff runing inside mac OSX or a dual boot if you want to ave a full PC only. Dont say "but you work on virtual machine bla bla bla" ...because microsoft if offering that solution to for Vista. They state that "now" XP incompatible software with Vista (yes its true) can run on Vista with VirtualPC2007!!!

There are software for mac that you dont get on PC to (belive or not -ex: look for medicals type) and vice versa. fortunently its possible to run PC software on mac, like said before. Many times regular users say that about software but never use them... like me, I can get everything I need to my home use. If I need to develop say: Vistual Studio 2005, I have a Virtualmachine doing that. or on extreme a dual boot Apple.

Vista is a good evolution for XP, I am using it for some time, but very quickly you are aware that you are on windows. Aero experience is nice, but after some time you are a bit tired, it confuses sometimes, everything is glassy.. .to much. Its like the 3d switching aplications, nice but not realy usable.

PCs are great to? herrmm ok... but in look they are always the same, a box, a usual cdrom etc... usualy a box with some diferent plastiks on it.. dell and Sony had some nice boxes...

[Guest Zim]

Well to add my 2pence worth.

Mac's Rock!! lol

anyway really its down to personal preference, i tend to go with the apple coz i think the OS, the harware and the design fit perfectly together. its a well thought out machine, and i really dont see why anyone would not consider buying one.. yes its a mac but u dont have to use the OS if u dont want too use bootcamp and install xp. After all u would marry an ugly person would you? so do the right thing.. get a mac! :)

Zim

[Guest The Doctor]

As for viruses, one of the main reason for this is due to availability and popularity of the systems. If the MAC became more mainstream for the home user worldwide then the threat of a virus would certainly change.

Yes thats true.

Mac's can and do get malware.

I don't think it will be long before the inroads that Macs are making into general commerce and amongst the fashion conscious will bring them to the forefront of hackers and virus writers minds and its gonna be bad when it happens.

I was inspired to get a mac after spending a day at birmingham university writing up a research project on a mac, the interface was just so clean and easy to use and just worked! i fell in love with it :) I'm not one of those fashion conscious who HAS to have the 'coolest' thing around. I don't even own an ipod! I was most impressed at how it just worked flawlessly.

As for malware, I've never had any problems with it and neither have other i know that have mac's. But you constantly hear of malware for PC's, new viruses etc.

Phil

[Guest The Doctor]

anyway really its down to personal preference, i tend to go with the apple coz i think the OS, the harware and the design fit perfectly together. its a well thought out machine, and i really dont see why anyone would not consider buying one..

Well said Zim :)

Phil

[Guest Porkspeare]

After being in PC support and Network support for 10 years I switched to Mac, what a refreshing change. It doesn't break every 10 mins, digital cameras, camcorders, mobile phones, etc just work without the need for installing a ton of drivers and rebooting. Also my Xbox 360 connects to the Mac just fine!

Also I run parallels on the MacBook and currently have Windows XP for my accounts software (Windows is now stable on decent hardware) and I have been Beta testing Windows Vista.

Vista is awful, it shouldn't be released it needs more work done on it. I can't wait for leopard now that is going to be by far the greatest OS.

Anyone looking to sync the Windows Mobile to the Mac will unfortunately need some 3rd Party software: http://www.markspace.com/missingsync_windowsmobile.php

[Guest The Doctor]

After being in PC support and Network support for 10 years I switched to Mac, what a refreshing change. It doesn't break every 10 mins, digital cameras, camcorders, mobile phones, etc just work without the need for installing a ton of drivers and rebooting. Also my Xbox 360 connects to the Mac just fine!

Also I run parallels on the MacBook and currently have Windows XP for my accounts software (Windows is now stable on decent hardware) and I have been Beta testing Windows Vista.

Vista is awful, it shouldn't be released it needs more work done on it. I can't wait for leopard now that is going to be by far the greatest OS.

Anyone looking to sync the Windows Mobile to the Mac will unfortunately need some 3rd Party software: http://www.markspace.com/missingsync_windowsmobile.php

The new leopard looks awesome. Especially the time machine function allowing you to view folders/files exactly as they were at any given time :) INFO

Phil

[Guest mupwangle]

>>>As for viruses, one of the main reason for this is due to availability and popularity of the systems. If the MAC became more mainstream for the home user worldwide then the threat of a virus would certainly change.

>>Yes thats true.

No it isn't.

Mac OS X, Linux and Unix are all fundamentally more secure than Windows and writing a virus for these systems is much, much harder and it is extremely rare for a virus (or malware) to spread by anything other than social engineering (otherwise known as preying on stupidity)

There's quite a decent explanation of this here: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2003/10/06/li...indows_viruses/

My personal record cleaning Windows viruses was 1851 individual viruses on one PC.

[Guest jimbouk]

And yet there's a news story today about another vulnerability in MAC's current OS (which hasnt been patched!)

As I and others on here have said before the growth of MAC usage will make the malware developers target MAC's - especially as tend to be used by higher net worth users on average than pc's.

Mac users should enjoy their relative safety whilst they can - the malware developers will enjoy a head start over the AV developers in the coming couple of years.

[Guest Alsicole]

Jimbo - there is already AV software for Mac. Norton has a version, Intego have very good AV software. It's all out there ready and regularly updated too.