Guest bensy Posted May 10, 2003 Report Share Posted May 10, 2003 I hope that smart customer service reads this forum once in a while. And probably answer some questions like WAP / GPRS / MMS settings, upgrades, etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ppcsurfr Posted May 11, 2003 Report Share Posted May 11, 2003 I don't think SMART Customer Care would be monitoring this site... but I don know some people from SMART Communications who are monitoring this forum. Mabuhay ~ Carlo (ppcsurfr) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jologs Posted May 15, 2003 Report Share Posted May 15, 2003 but if they do...... patay syang ang mga unlocked phone... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ppcsurfr Posted May 15, 2003 Report Share Posted May 15, 2003 @jologs: hehehe. That's why they're already thinking of how to implement SIM-locking in a different fashion... sobra daw bulgar ang pag post ng unlocking procedure... Tsk tsk tsk. Mabuhay ~ Carlo (ppcsurfr) President Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pyke Posted June 3, 2003 Report Share Posted June 3, 2003 speaking of the customer service of SMART,well it freakin' sucks.call me bad but there are times that i call and ask them questions that i already know the answers to, just to drain out my battery.man, they come up with such phony answers just to get over the call.then, i'll call again that same minute,ask the same question and i get a different but another wrong answer. i dont trust them no more. try them yourselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest T0722 Posted June 4, 2003 Report Share Posted June 4, 2003 @jologs: hehehe. That's why they're already thinking of how to implement SIM-locking in a different fashion... sobra daw bulgar ang pag post ng unlocking procedure... Tsk tsk tsk. Mabuhay ~ Carlo (ppcsurfr) President there would always be away of unlocking it hehe kung ang windows xp sabi it's something that with an anti-piracy feature. e di pa nga officially launched noon may xp na na pirated e hehe... and beside's unlocking it is not piracy so it's up to the consumer if he/she wants to unlock the phone. ang pede lang nila gawin is to void warranty if unlocked. like in nokia/ericsson service centers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest grifter Posted June 4, 2003 Report Share Posted June 4, 2003 The reason why the telcos are SIM locking the phones they're selling is coz the phone is either free or subsidized. Lugi naman sila if they give you the phone for free and you use it for some other cellular network. hehe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mar9118 Posted June 4, 2003 Report Share Posted June 4, 2003 I beg to disagree na lugi sila, the SAP comes free with a 24 months contract under plan 1995 or 1335 for Addictmobile so you can use another provider's SIM if you unlock you phone but you still have to pay Smart for 24 months otherwise they charge you pre-termination fee. With the Pre-paid ones paying P 22,290.00 is already buying the unit, so I don't get the logic on why they really have to SIM lock the phones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ppcsurfr Posted June 4, 2003 Report Share Posted June 4, 2003 @mar9118: Lugi sila in the sense na may kahati sila... I think all telcos share the same sentiments... may it be SMART, Globe or Sun. Ayaw nila ng kahati sa services at earnings... Mabuhay ~ Carlo (ppcsurfr) President Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest eric73ph Posted June 4, 2003 Report Share Posted June 4, 2003 Forget about customer support. I resolved all my issues here in this forum. You buy the smartphone then it's tantamount to saying you are on your own. :-) I have already been in a meeting with the product manager and the sys dev't manager of SMART tel co and even the Microsoft PR person and all I got was a free frapuccinno. I am still very unclear as to what direction they want to take with regards to this potentially good product. I think it's high time I gave Nazareno my two cents worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest eric73ph Posted June 4, 2003 Report Share Posted June 4, 2003 BTW, I would love to know which person from SMART monitors this forum because I had to teach people in SMART how to unlock their smartphones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mar9118 Posted June 4, 2003 Report Share Posted June 4, 2003 @mar9118: Lugi sila in the sense na may kahati sila... I think all telcos share the same sentiments... may it be SMART, Globe or Sun. Ayaw nila ng kahati sa services at earnings... Mabuhay ~ Carlo (ppcsurfr) President Hello Carlo, Personally I see no real sense in unlocking the SAP but as it is we live in a free country and we don't want to be restricted by any means :wink: But as I have explained, they give us a free phone with a 24 months contract, so saan sila lugi? at saan sila magkaroon ng kahati? most of us I believe subscribe to lines from at least 2 networks, I have 3 post paid lines from Smart and 5 line from Globe, I also issued touchmobile, Smart Buddy SIM to my employees. It's not a crime to unlock our phone so I consider it a personal choice and a void warranty :-) Best regards, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ppcsurfr Posted June 4, 2003 Report Share Posted June 4, 2003 @ mar9118: Well, did you ever think why there is such a thing as SIM-locking and why phones have this feature? It may not be a crime, but it can still go against a policy. A network is free to set its policies right? GSM phones are SIM-lockable by design which makes it a feature for the network. There is nothing illegal about it. If you want a Tanager that is truly not locked to any network, you can always go to PPCW.Net and purchase one for US$549.00 http://ads.ppcw.net/adclick.php?bannerid=4...hop%2Fimate.php I think the bottom line here is that no telco will want you to use a competing service... If you manage 8 lines, they'd rather have all 8 lines subscribed to them... Well that's how things are. That's how things were designed. That's how things will be and the only way things will change is when all telcos around the world stop implementing SIM locks to the phones or if all manufacturers remove this feature on all GSM phones. Just remember the 2 levels of accessibilities of the system settings of the phone... there is user access and network access. Some people have been tampering with settigs only networks are supposed to be tinkering with and by this... if a company voids a warranty, I guess all we can do is accept it. Mabuhay ~ Carlo (ppcsurfr) president Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mar9118 Posted June 5, 2003 Report Share Posted June 5, 2003 Hello Carlo, You are sounding like a lawyer representing the telco, as I have pointed out earlier, I have nothing against SIM locking or SIM unlocking. It's a matter of choice by the telco and the end user living in a free country like ours. What I was trying to point out is your remark that the telco are loosing money because of unlocking and that I beg to disagree because they are not and their phones are not really given away without any strings attached, right? Now going to the technicalities of SIM locking, yes this is a feature built-in to all GSM phones and can be enabled or disabled by the telco, but if the purpose of both the phone maker and service provider is to have a phone exclusively for use with their system then the SIM locking process should have been design one way without any means of undoing it (this I am sure is not hard to do) then SIM unlocking will be a thing of the past. Best regards, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ppcsurfr Posted June 5, 2003 Report Share Posted June 5, 2003 @mar9118: Really funny. :lol: Me sound like a lawyer? Hahaha... my profession is miles away from that... Good for you if you don't have anything against SIM-locking, but I do. I'd be willing to pay for a SMART Communications authorized SIM-unlocking service. That is if they can give a realistic price on that too. Now to answer some questions about SMART's Customer Care, etc. and beig left in the dark or on our own... A SMART official mentioned something in the past about Wireless Culture and Internet Culture. SMART is still in the Wireless Culture stage and they are trying to learn more about the Internet Culture which most of the techies are living in. What does this mean? Well, if SMART were to live the pure Wireless Culture way, we would have Smartphones which cannot be upgraded, which cannot be personalized by adding applications, and with Smartphones acting dumb because all features are deactivated for the benefit of the Telco. How can this benefit a Telco? Simple... they don't have to go the extra mile to learn the intricate details of a Smartphone... But they opted to be more open to the Internet Culture... so here we are with Smartphones that we can play around with. We can download stuff, install stuff, modify stuff... but the draw abck here is that if there is a problem... what do we do? We run to SMART? Why? They ddn't manufacture the phone... SMART is a Telco... that's why if you read the first part of this thread I already gave a warning about it. I know SMART is trying to learn more about the SMART Amazing Phone, but they cannot spend all their time training every personel about the SAP... The SAP is a never-ending affair. New apps are released almost everyday, new tweaks, new features, occasionally the new ROM updates... That is why you have MoDaCo. This serves as a venue to share information and to learn more about the device. Just remember, the SMART Amazing Phone is not a simple phone. It is a Windows-powered Mobile Device. The outside may look like a phone, the controls may look like a phone's, but the inside is pure Windows CE. Oh btw, as for the SIM-unlock procedure... just like I said, the information on SIM-unlocking most phones are reserved for tech people in the telcos and the manufactrer's technical facilities... While they have made their way outside these facilities and have spread around to even non-techies is not a good thing... just like pirated CDs of evaluation copies of movies for the acadamy have made its way around the local market. If you ask me why isn't anyone doing about it? Just go to Greenhills and see... that should answer your question... or make you wonder even more. You may be right about the Telco not really losing anything... but just as I said... they simply don't want you to use any other telco. :wink: And before I forget... there is news of a new SIM-Locking procedure for the SAP... one that cannot be broken unless you do a complete reflash... this is not confirmed though... but if it is true... then your last paragraph has been answered. :D So bottom line is... if you want to learn more aout the SAP, join the local Smartphone Users Group and keep on visiting this site. If you need to complain about the service, then go to SMART. If you need the phone repaired send it to SMART/Brightpoint. Do not expect anything about software, configrations, tweaks from SMART's customer care. Mabuhay ~ Carlo (ppcsurfr) President Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mar9118 Posted June 5, 2003 Report Share Posted June 5, 2003 Hello Carlo, Wow! that was some response and I am speechless :lol: That was some real nice thing you have describing the SmartPhone and I totally agree with you, that is why I bought the SmartPhone in the first place to be able to do what I did with my computer on my phone :wink: True the latest release of SAP comes with bootloader version 0.99 and the SPV Unlock software does not work on it, someone claimed that he was able to go around it by installing the Orange update, unlocking the phone then reinstalling the SAP ROM update, I didn't have the chance to try it because I don't have version 0.99 bootloader but if you compare it to a computer the 0.99 version is like a BIOS update and that is normally not affected by OS installation, I stand to be corrected though if I am wrong. More power! Best regards, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bongmanuel Posted June 5, 2003 Report Share Posted June 5, 2003 I have already referred this site to my wife at Smart and they are currently monitoring this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest grifter Posted June 5, 2003 Report Share Posted June 5, 2003 @mar9118, the simlock feature is built into the bootloader level, not in the OS level. this is the reason why we needed to go into the bootloader screen before we run spvunlock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mar9118 Posted June 5, 2003 Report Share Posted June 5, 2003 @grifter, Thanks, that is exactly what I thought :-) Anyway for my friend and others who have SAP with version 0.99 bootloader I am sure someone will come out with an updated unlocker soon and if not there will always be a way to go around it :wink: Best regards, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest grifter Posted June 5, 2003 Report Share Posted June 5, 2003 @mar9118, you can downgrade the bootloader to 0.98. it was discussed somewhere in this forum. just do a search. after getting the unlock code and unlocking the SAP, re-flash it with ROM 137. Voila! Back to 0.99. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mar9118 Posted June 5, 2003 Report Share Posted June 5, 2003 @grifter, Are you referring to the topic "unlock stops at 66%" posted by mebius? my friend tried his method but got errors and I posted a message asking him what Orange Update country version did he use but so far no response yet. Anyway thanks a lot :lol: Best regards, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ppcsurfr Posted June 5, 2003 Report Share Posted June 5, 2003 I just came from SMART Tower. I got to talk to several people there. Here is how things stand. 1. SMART Communications' responsibility is the Telephony service they offer... which means... if you experience any service problems, you can complain to SMART via *888 or 888-1111. 2. The SMART Customer Care officers are trained to answer generic phone setup questions as well as questions on the SAP which are included in the SAP FAQs which was created some time ago. 3. SMART Customer Care will try to encurage their officers to learn more about the SAP, but this may be on a superficial level. For more detailed information, queries may be directed to the local Smartphone Users Group or the Pinoy Forum at MoDaCo. Here is what I nderstand from the conversation I had this afternoon. SMART is trying to learn more about the SAP but cannot put 100% of its efforts into it as it also has to take care of other things like Services, and other Handsets. SMART encourages community support where advanced users help out other users to make the most of their devices. The SMART Amazing Phone affair is a two-way street. SMART learns from its users and SMART will try to find a way to integrate fixes, 3rd party or otherwise to improve the platform for a better SMART Amazing Phone experience. While it may be near impossible to the hundreds and hundreds of Customer Care Officers to learn the intricacies of the SAP, there are a few in the company who have extensive knowledge about the platform. The problem is, one person cannot attend to everyone's complaint, query, or whatever... and the many who are available to answer the questions have no extensive knowledge. I think what I have written so far can be considered as some sort of a guideline as to where to go to when help is needed. Mabuhay ~ Carlo (ppcsurfr) president Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest grifter Posted June 6, 2003 Report Share Posted June 6, 2003 @mar9118, nope. it's not the orange update. just do a search for "update bootloader" you have to download the 0.98 bootloader and a small program "usbterm". use usbterm to load the 0.98 bootloader onto the phone. then you can get the unlock code. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest eric73ph Posted June 6, 2003 Report Share Posted June 6, 2003 Carlo is correct in his statement that the SAP is more than a phone. But I think it should be a Tel Co's responsibility to give proper support to their subscribers. They have opened a Pandora's Box so to speak and with that, they bear the responsibility of added support. I had already approached SMART to at least advertise or even partner with Modaco...and what is the response I get? A photocopied brochure that is now included in every SAP package detailing how to access your mail, or change your settings or what not. I wouldn't be surprised if they tell me the reason they cannot partner with Modaco is that this site offers the knowledge of unlocking the SAP. It's a whole load of crap if you ask me. Another thing... Carlo mentioned that he has talked to customer support and he gave you his impressions on what SMART is doing. Well, try talking to people who directly affect the future (i.e. product and IT managers) of the SAP in SMART and you will be dismayed on their response. They gave me the impression that they are just resting on their laurels. Do you know that they had a development team that was supposed to have been prepared to create Smartphone applications in-house? I wonder where those bodies are. I just hope they have learned their lesson. Oh and did I also mention that Microsoft will NOT entertain queries regarding the Smartphone OS? The Tel Co's will be on their own with regards to customer support. Bottomline problem is.... SMART is still treating these integrated devices as cell phones and nothing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ppcsurfr Posted June 6, 2003 Report Share Posted June 6, 2003 @eric: If SMART will partner with anyone, it will be a pure Fililpino group and the most likely candidate for that would be the PinoyPocketPC or PinoySmartphone groups. SMART is not at fault here. If SMART forms a software developing body in-house, DO NOT expect them to help out with miscellaneous stuff. When yo buy a PC, do you ask the store you bought it from how to set up the dozens of applications you purchased or how to hack the registry? Most likely not. We're in the age of unlimited expandability and that alone becomes the greatest obstacle in any expandable convergeant device. You are asking a telephony service provider to answer computer stuff!!! :shock: Why isn't Microsoft helping out here? Why is it you can't talk to anyone in Microsoft Philippines about the SAP? Well, it is very simple. There is no Microsoft Mobile Devices Division in Microsoft Philippines. All they handle are retail products. It doesn't mean that because the person works in Microsoft he knows everything about the SAP or Windows CE. It is true that it would be nice if SMART Customer Care knew so much about the SAP right? But remember, it may take years to learn so much about a certain OS or a certain device. You might lash back at me now saying that the SMART Amazing Phone is a new device... Yes it is a new device, a device which actually retains so much of its origins from the original Pocket PC which was released 3 years ago. So what do you really have? An OS which is basically 3 years old, tweaked, modified, and trimmed down to fit a phone. The SAP is not a dead end product. Go to PPCW.Net and research on the types of phones. You have the basic phone which does basic telephony and messaging. You have the Feature-Phones which have added features like a dedicated browser or email client and some hard coded feature. And you have the Smartphones which are phones that have an OS and has expandability features. No one in their right mind will expect all Customer Care Officers to research on the web all possible solutions. The problems and spolutions are just so plenty that it will take them so long to learn them and if they do try to learn them, they won't actually have any time to answer any of our calls. It is simple logic. On the other hand, there is the PinoyPocket PC and PinoySmartphone group... 2 groups which are very much related as they are basically run by only one set of officers. Recognized by Miscrosoft Philippines as the official Windows CE Users group in the Philippines, the group aims to help fellow Windows CE users and fosters camaraderie and a source for knowledge. It's everyone's choice now. You can go and try to move heaven and earth to get SMART learn more about the product so that your questions may be answered? or You can join the local communities recognized by Microsoft and most likely get your answers in a jiffy. Mabuhay ~ Carlo (ppcsurfr) President Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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