Sega GG + Nintendo GameBoy emulator for SP beta test

[Guest bitbank]

A new problem has been brought to my attention today that I'm correcting. Apparently the HTC Touch Pro keyboard behaves differently from other keyboards and doesn't allow the keys to work in SmartGear. I've been able to reproduce and correct the problem and will include it in a new build shortly. I'm surprised no one else with Touch Pro came forward with this problem. If there are other devices which exhibit a similar problem with the keyboard please let me know. The symptom is that every key shows up as the same HEX value in the key definition dialog box. In this case, the value is E5. If this occurs on other devices and the number is different, please let me know and I'll write a correction.

L.B.

[Guest Torrast]

If you guys are not happy with the current touchscreen controls, would an oncreen control panel work better for you?

Would you be happier with something like this?

L.B.

That control scheme looks great! The only thing I'd mention is that the Start and Select keys are somewhat infrequently used, and are not generally integral the the action taking place in most games, so they do not absolutely have to be added to the screen. This may allow for more room for the actual gaming buttons, and trying to add Start and Select will likely make them too small to use effectively without a stylus, which kills the convenience of a touchscreen (as is the case, in my opinion, with PocketSNES). The iPhone, as pictured there (or is that just a re-skin?), has a bit more screen space so it is not quite as big of an issue. Just be wary of making the touchpad and main buttons (A and B for all devices, including C for Genesis, as well as X and Y for SNES, maybe the L and R buttons can be put at the upper left and right corners, respectively, with the screen set slightly down from them?) too small, as this will cause the user to unintentionally pause quite a bit, or else enter the wrong command.

As to the issue with the Touch Pro, I think the reason this hasn't been brought up is due to the fact that there is a program called K for Touch Pro that allows each key to be mapped correctly. However, there is the unfortunate side effect that this must be reversed before powering off the phone, else the Today screen may not load up, as well as other issues with SMS usage, etc. Adding touchscreen controls like that, and fixing the keyboard issue from within Smartgear (making K for Touch Pro obsolete) would garner my purchase real damn quick! :)

[Guest Seberus]

Thats exactly what I had hope for, and I rly dont mind useing the Stylus while playing, as I tried so far the Demo Versions with 3x Buttons on it.

I think that would work great like that, and if you are using the Mobile in Landscape, you could easily put the to the left and right side, and then still have a normal 4:3 Screen in the middle I guess, as most games out of the past were supposed to look like, not like the stretched version it would be in landscape otherwise.

The Buttons wouldnt need to look like the real controllers, they should be kept small and close together, for pressing them just convenient with a stylus, imho, not to take away to much space.

But I mentioned already befor, that simply increasing the touchscreen grid to 3x3 would add enough Buttons, to set all keys needed for playing SNES or atleast GBC properly, as for now, all my keys cant be really mapped properly, (and I have only 4) and with the only 3 Buttons you can map now with the implemented touchscreen system, I can not even map start, select a and b for gbc, not talking about L, R and the 4 Buttons of a SNES Controller.

With a 3x3 grid and a bit of practicing, it would be atleast possible to play the games, but ofc such onscreen buttons would be simply awesome :)

and Im sorry if I sounded kind of rude or upset you with my posts, I guess I was just a bit disappointed that my posts so far were always unnoticed somehow <.<

Would be really cool if something like that could be added, and if possible specific to the platform's need of Buttons "snes, gbc, sega, etc"

Edited January 20, 2009 by Seberus

[Guest PolloLoco]

A new problem has been brought to my attention today that I'm correcting. Apparently the HTC Touch Pro keyboard behaves differently from other keyboards and doesn't allow the keys to work in SmartGear. I've been able to reproduce and correct the problem and will include it in a new build shortly. I'm surprised no one else with Touch Pro came forward with this problem. If there are other devices which exhibit a similar problem with the keyboard please let me know. The symptom is that every key shows up as the same HEX value in the key definition dialog box. In this case, the value is E5. If this occurs on other devices and the number is different, please let me know and I'll write a correction.

L.B.

I didn't report this with my Touch Pro because I considered it an issue that knowledgeable members would research with their phones. This isn't just a Smartgear issue - it's an issue with most every program that uses keyboard input.

There's two solutions. Originally - I used the "K for Touch Pro" application mentioned above, which runs in the background. But it has defects that require resetting after using it, even after closing out the application.

Other users have figured out that the problem is actually the XT9 keyboard features. Which I never use. So, if you disable it - you can use keyboard input without any problems. The cab file I used is "duttythroy Disable xt9". I've been using this for weeks with no negative side effects. In fact, I believe it's got less lag in games than using K for Touch Pro.

Another problem with the Touch Pro not mentioned is lag with keyboard inputs that make games next to impossible to play. You press the keyboard button and the game freezes until the input is accepted. Some foreign phones don't have this problem. For everyone else that does, there's two registry settings to reduce or eliminate this lag. I don't know them off the top of my head, but I'd posted them in the Touch Pro software section of the XDA developers forums. There's a thread on emulation where all this is discussed.

Again, it's a phone specific issue that individual members should have researched - so I'm disappointed that it's holding up this release.

[Guest bitbank]

I didn't report this with my Touch Pro because I considered it an issue that knowledgeable members would research with their phones. This isn't just a Smartgear issue - it's an issue with most every program that uses keyboard input.

There's two solutions. Originally - I used the "K for Touch Pro" application mentioned above, which runs in the background. But it has defects that require resetting after using it, even after closing out the application.

Other users have figured out that the problem is actually the XT9 keyboard features. Which I never use. So, if you disable it - you can use keyboard input without any problems. The cab file I used is "duttythroy Disable xt9". I've been using this for weeks with no negative side effects. In fact, I believe it's got less lag in games than using K for Touch Pro.

Another problem with the Touch Pro not mentioned is lag with keyboard inputs that make games next to impossible to play. You press the keyboard button and the game freezes until the input is accepted. Some foreign phones don't have this problem. For everyone else that does, there's two registry settings to reduce or eliminate this lag. I don't know them off the top of my head, but I'd posted them in the Touch Pro software section of the XDA developers forums. There's a thread on emulation where all this is discussed.

Again, it's a phone specific issue that individual members should have researched - so I'm disappointed that it's holding up this release.

You're right Pollo,

The Touch Pro keyboard is a complete disaster. The only keys which work correctly are the arrow keys, back, shift, ok, and caps. The rest of the keyboard sends WM_CHAR messages and not WM_KEYDOWN/WM_KEYUP. There is no way for a game to use the slide out keyboard since you won't be able to know if a key is being held down. The other problem is the default T9 behavior is incredibly annoying and pops up a window for you to add/search dictionary entries. It can be disabled, but less experienced users would probably not know how. I guess the touchscreen is the way to go for this device.

I'm not sure why HTC would do this. They did the keyboard on the Vox correctly. It seems that they keep making their newest devices have more and more strange behaviors.

I can write a workaround for this problem, but I don't think it's useful. I can write code which detects that 1 key is pressed and released, but if 2 keys are pressed and 1 is released, I won't be able to tell which one was released. I just tested this and the key_up message has no useful info in it to know which key was released. I think this would cause more confusion than it would solve. Opinions?

L.B.

Edited January 20, 2009 by bitbank

[Guest tgwaste]

You're right Pollo,

The Touch Pro keyboard is a complete disaster. The only keys which work correctly are the arrow keys, back, shift, ok, and caps. The rest of the keyboard sends WM_CHAR messages and not WM_KEYDOWN/WM_KEYUP. There is no way for a game to use the slide out keyboard since you won't be able to know if a key is being held down. The other problem is the default T9 behavior is incredibly annoying and pops up a window for you to add/search dictionary entries. It can be disabled, but less experienced users would probably not know how. I guess the touchscreen is the way to go for this device.

I'm not sure why HTC would do this. They did the keyboard on the Vox correctly. It seems that they keep making their newest devices have more and more strange behaviors.

I can write a workaround for this problem, but I don't think it's useful. I can write code which detects that 1 key is pressed and released, but if 2 keys are pressed and 1 is released, I won't be able to tell which one was released. I just tested this and the key_up message has no useful info in it to know which key was released. I think this would cause more confusion than it would solve. Opinions?

L.B.

im slightly confused. does disabling the T9 fix the keyboard problems and allow it to work properlly with SmartGear? If so maybe make a link on your web site or something with instructions on how to disable it. This is probably a registry setting right? Maybe make an option in SmartGear to disable/enable T9 in the registry?

[Guest bitbank]

im slightly confused. does disabling the T9 fix the keyboard problems and allow it to work properlly with SmartGear? If so maybe make a link on your web site or something with instructions on how to disable it. This is probably a registry setting right? Maybe make an option in SmartGear to disable/enable T9 in the registry?

Disabling the T9 option allows the key definition dialog to work, but doesn't fix the underlying problem. The Touch Pro keyboard is still a total loss.

L.B.

Edited January 20, 2009 by bitbank

[Guest tgwaste]

Disabling the T9 option allows the key definition dialog to work, but doesn't fit the underlying problem. The Touch Pro keyboard is still a total loss.

L.B.

ahh. well now im REALLY glad I didnt buy that device. :)

[Guest bitbank]

Again, it's a phone specific issue that individual members should have researched - so I'm disappointed that it's holding up this release.

The keyboard issue is not holding up this release. I'm buried under lots of work at the moment and I would publish it, but now the Genesis code doesn't work because Visual Studio is barfing on my 68k ASM code. My ARM 68K emulator is 240K lines of code (and hasn't changed much since 1.0.4) and some internal table is overflowing in the assembler or linker. I will probably have to build it on Embedded VC 4, but I don't have that environment set up on my new machine. Hopefully I can get it to work in VS2005 (I'm using VS2008 at the moment). I'll try to get it going this week.

L.B.

[Guest PolloLoco]

I think my post was misunderstood - because I definitely don't think the keyboard for the Touch Pro is a total loss. I just think that Smartgear shouldn't be rewritten to accomodate it.

If people disable the t9 keyboard using the cab file I specified (use google because I don't remember where I got it), and use the registry settings to eliminate lag - then the keyboard is very usable for emulators. In fact, it's better than the 6700 in that sense because you don't have to run a separate program for simultaneous keypresses.

Besides disabling the t9 keyboard, the registry settings are in post #75 on this thread:

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread...4658&page=8

[Guest bitbank]

I sent a note to HTC and got back some useful info about the keyboard problem. Apparently it's Microsoft's doing, not HTC. There's some sort of key translation that occurs and the 0xE5 value is defined as VK_PROCESSKEY. I wrote some ugly workaround code, but I believe it works properly now (WITH NO VISIBLE LAG!). I still have some orientation / stretching issues to resolve, but at least the keyboard part is solved. Overall, HTC doesn't seem to be making any game-friendly devices. IMHO, the Touch Pro is pretty terrible for playing games and not much better as a phone for the following reasons:

1) Few hardware buttons; the ones that do exist require lots of force and have little tactile feedback

2) The D-Pad is definitely gamer-unfriendly

3) The device feels heavy

For my taste, the best WM devices for use as a phone and for playing games are the HTC Juno or the HTC Vox. Nothing else compares. Touchscreen devices are too annoying to use as a phone and playing games with touchscreen controls basically sucks.

L.B.

P.S. I still need to fix a few things, but I'll try to at least get a good beta build out this week.

Edited January 21, 2009 by bitbank

[Guest PolloLoco]

I'll agree with the 3 negative comments you make. But most of the gaming I do is in landscape mode, so the bad "joystick" controls usually don't affect me. However, I've been happy with the Touch Pro as a gaming device for the following reasons:

1) Once configured, keyboard gaming works well.

2) There's little speed dropoff coming from a 624 mhz (oced) 6700 - and this is a VGA device.

3) I love the added quirk of using TV out to play from my couch.

That said, I've currently seen a little more lag with TG16 games on smartgear than other systems - I'm not sure why that would be. I'm looking forward to your next release - I'd love to see Genesis with sound.

[Guest tgwaste]

For my taste, the best WM devices for use as a phone and for playing games are the HTC Juno or the HTC Vox. Nothing else compares. Touchscreen devices are too annoying to use as a phone and playing games with touchscreen controls basically sucks.

the Treo Pro also works extremely well. :)

[Guest bitbank]

Status update:

I'm readying a new build and making sure things work well. Working with the Touch Pro has exposed a bunch of bugs having to do with VGA support and different orientations of the display. Here are the main issues:

1) VGA devices with slide out keyboards had incorrectly rotated display and keyboard settings

2) New previously played game feature didn't draw nicely on VGA displays in either orientation

3) Fit-to-Win* mode was overshooting the edge of the screen on VGA displays, causing a flickery line at the top

I got confirmation that I fixed the Touch Pro keyboard issue from another user, so that will be included too. I'll post a new build hopefully tonight even if the Genesis code is not working.

L.B.

[Guest bitbank]

New Build

I still haven't got the Genesis code building correctly, but at least you guys can try the latest code. This build fixes some orientation and paint problems with VGA devices; it also fixes the keyboard issues with the HTC Touch Pro. I also fixed some paint issues with the main screen. Please give it a try and let me know if you find any problems.

L.B.

Update: Visual Studio 2008 was the reason the Genesis code wasn't working. I had to recreate the project in VS2005 and now it works. I'll post a new build soon.

smartgear.zip

Edited January 25, 2009 by bitbank

[Guest Torrast]

New Build

I still haven't got the Genesis code building correctly, but at least you guys can try the latest code. This build fixes some orientation and paint problems with VGA devices; it also fixes the keyboard issues with the HTC Touch Pro. I also fixed some paint issues with the main screen. Please give it a try and let me know if you find any problems.

L.B.

The keyboard controls are working much better on the Touch Pro now, I can tell you that. Now that I can comfortably play games, I notice there appears to be a minor issue with the graphics, but I suspect that is due to my device more than the software. For example, in the Gameboy game Final Fantasy Legend (a game that you can get into quickly to test as much as possible within the 2 min timeframe) seems to suffer from a vertical sort of "clipping" effect as you walk. This is especially noticeable when you pass by mountains or through forests. Probably not a dealbreaker, but its distracting. This, too, appears to happen while playing Final Fantasy for the NES (another fast loader). I notice this only seems to happen in Fit2Win and * screen sizes, but the 150% and lower sizes are too small to play comfortably. I suppose its something one simply gets used to; I guess you can't have everything :).

Overall, this looks promising. I look forward to being able to test this build with Genesis support, and being able to verify whether or not this, for lack of better description, "clipping" effect is experienced there. It seems that the Touch Pro makes a person jump through hoops to get a good gaming experience :\.

[Guest bitbank]

I notice there appears to be a minor issue with the graphics, but I suspect that is due to my device more than the software. For example, in the Gameboy game Final Fantasy Legend (a game that you can get into quickly to test as much as possible within the 2 min timeframe) seems to suffer from a vertical sort of "clipping" effect as you walk. This is especially noticeable when you pass by mountains or through forests. Probably not a dealbreaker, but its distracting. This, too, appears to happen while playing Final Fantasy for the NES (another fast loader). I notice this only seems to happen in Fit2Win and * screen sizes, but the 150% and lower sizes are too small to play comfortably. I suppose its something one simply gets used to; I guess you can't have everything :).

I believe I've found and corrected this problem. The stretchblt code was using a 8-bit fraction to compute the math and it was getting overflow errors which caused the painting to go beyond the edge of the display and wrap around.

L.B.

[Guest tgwaste]

everything is working pretty well so far. still really wish I could play punch out :)

SNES shouldnt really be playable yet right ?

[Guest mikeeey]

If you guys are not happy with the current touchscreen controls, would an oncreen control panel work better for you?

Would you be happier with something like this?

L.B.

I personally would like something like that AND the old controls. But since I have a kaiser and it lags horribly when the screen is touched and makes me want to drop kick the phone, I'm fine without touchscreen controls :)

[Guest tgwaste]

is there any way to make it so that if you tap/click on a .sv game (ie: zelda.1_nes.sv2) it can open ../smartgear.exe and run that save?

since you store the last 10 in the registry it would be awesome to make a homescreen plus theme to display the pictures on the today screen and then load the .sv onTap

:)

[Guest jtran]

I have a Blackjack 2 and am trying to save a game but I can't for some reason. Anyone know why?

[Guest tgwaste]

/me wonders if LB is still alive... :(

Edited February 18, 2009 by tgwaste

[Guest geeve420]

First let me say Hi to everyone!

Well I went ahead and bought this last night and I have to say well done best money I have spent for this phone!! It is the only Emu I could get to work on my treo 750. I have just a few minor issues that I thought you might like to know about:

1) In the settings option it won't let me scroll down to change all the options i.e. Video size and rapid fire.

2) When exiting It leaves my task bar a little funny.

3) Some Genesis roms crashout (maybe the roms)

Those are the only real issues I have had, none of wich are serious just kind of annoying. All in all great program. I had a heck of a time finding an Emu for my Treo and this one just works. I have tested NES, GBC, with great results. I tried others but because I can't change video size they are unplayable. One more suggestion would be to add an Atari 2600 Emu as well. Oh how I miss Combat :(

Thanks

Geeve

[Guest tgwaste]

First let me say Hi to everyone!

Well I went ahead and bought this last night and I have to say well done best money I have spent for this phone!! It is the only Emu I could get to work on my treo 750. I have just a few minor issues that I thought you might like to know about:

1) In the settings option it won't let me scroll down to change all the options i.e. Video size and rapid fire.

2) When exiting It leaves my task bar a little funny.

3) Some Genesis roms crashout (maybe the roms)

Those are the only real issues I have had, none of wich are serious just kind of annoying. All in all great program. I had a heck of a time finding an Emu for my Treo and this one just works. I have tested NES, GBC, with great results. I tried others but because I can't change video size they are unplayable. One more suggestion would be to add an Atari 2600 Emu as well. Oh how I miss Combat :(

Thanks

Geeve

hey,

if you look at post (#1065)in this thread you can download a newer version that

fixes the scrolling issue as well as adds a bunch of really cool functions.

it breaks Genesis though and SNES doesnt really work right yet. Hopefully LB will post a new version soon.

Edited February 18, 2009 by tgwaste

[Guest geeve420]

hey,

if you look at post (#1065)in this thread you can download a newer version that

fixes the scrolling issue as well as adds a bunch of really cool functions.

it breaks Genesis though and SNES doesnt really work right yet. Hopefully LC will post a new version soon.

I'll check it out thanks. I thought I had the latest version w/ 1.0.4. I got it from the site. I'll look into it though.

Can anyone tell me if post 1065 is newer than the version i have?

Thanks

Geeve

Edited February 17, 2009 by geeve420