Ebay/PayPal scam?

[Guest amo]

Ok, so I sold my PSP on ebay today. The buyer who bought it has been a member only since the 21st of December so has no feedback. They however paid immedietly via PayPal and I have initiated the process of transfering the money into my account.

Of course the PayPal account he used to pay is unconfirmed and therefore seller protection is not available. Am I right to be cautious about this?

What could potentially go wrong? Is there a "hack" im not aware of that allows him to claim the money back off me as soon as I send him the PSP?

Or am I just best to wait for the money to go into my bank and then send it to him???

Thanks guys! Really appreciate your input...

[Guest Wombleuk]

Ok, so I sold my PSP on ebay today. The buyer who bought it has been a member only since the 21st of December so has no feedback. They however paid immedietly via PayPal and I have initiated the process of transfering the money into my account.

Of course the PayPal account he used to pay is unconfirmed and therefore seller protection is not available. Am I right to be cautious about this?

What could potentially go wrong? Is there a "hack" im not aware of that allows him to claim the money back off me as soon as I send him the PSP?

Or am I just best to wait for the money to go into my bank and then send it to him???

Thanks guys! Really appreciate your input...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Once he pays by Paypal, the money is automatically taken out of his bank account/credit card.

You should be OK, but it's worth waiting a day or two for the funds to get into your bank account.

We all started with zero feedback .... :)

Edited December 21, 2005 by Wombleuk

[Guest fluffcat1]

Ok, so I sold my PSP on ebay today. The buyer who bought it has been a member only since the 21st of December so has no feedback. They however paid immedietly via PayPal and I have initiated the process of transfering the money into my account.

Of course the PayPal account he used to pay is unconfirmed and therefore seller protection is not available. Am I right to be cautious about this?

What could potentially go wrong? Is there a "hack" im not aware of that allows him to claim the money back off me as soon as I send him the PSP?

Or am I just best to wait for the money to go into my bank and then send it to him???

Thanks guys! Really appreciate your input...

Does his paypal email address match the ebay one? Is it a 'free' account? ( hotmail, yahoo, freeserve payg, gmail etc etc) - one that requires no info to sign up? The most obvious thing they will do is either initiate a chargeback and claim they never made the transaction, or use someone elses card as you can upto £200 before verification of the card is needed. This only happens when either the person who's card it is notices - give them a few weeks at least, or VISA flag the card as stolen if they#ve been going CrAzY with it :evil:

The only way to 100% cover your ass is to *not send it*. Email them, refund the payment and offer a discount of free shipping etc if they pay cash into your bank. Bet you they turn you down, but worth it for your own peace of mind. Paypal will claw back funds upto ***6 months*** later! The only thing you can do is close the account, change the card numbers asscoiated with it, and instruct your bank not to pay any DD's for them. But then they'll try to send the balifs round, as being a law-abiding trustworthy Paypal user, you registered with your own info and not false stuff....

I don't accept paypal for high value items that people are likely to try to claw back on - phones, pdas, top end cd players etc etc. If they're new to ebay, why are they jumping in at the deep end bidding high on high value stuff? Go learn the ropes somewhere else on a cheapo auction ta.

Sorry, if I sound like I'm biased against paypal - it's because I am, but not through past experience thankfully. I managed to get UPS to recall the £3k amps I was sending to Hong Kong :roll:

read www.paypalsucks.com - there is a uk section.

Richard

[Guest fluffcat1]

Looking into it further, the guy bought a sim free w550 for 200 notes 5 minutes before that. What sort of new buyer registers on ebay then drops £500 on purchases within minutes of joining having never bid on anything else unless it's not his own card he's using?

Check the electoral register for the address they want you to send to. At least confirm someone of that name lives there. Request their details via ebay, see if they match, get the phone number, see if it matches BT's 192 for the address and *ring it* - if a mobile, walk away. If they ask why are you ringing, say you're from a courier company and need to confirm the address for the guarenteed chrimbo delivery as your client's writing is illegible or something.

Paypal WILL NOT HELP YOU if it all goes wrong. Neither will the police.

Richard

[Guest amo]

Ok, i'm very worried now! Thanks for all the input fluffcat.

The sale was for £278 in total, and the payment was made in full. I just don't know if i should send the item or not!

[Guest fluffcat1]

Ok, i'm very worried now! Thanks for all the input fluffcat.

The sale was for £278 in total, and the payment was made in full. I just don't know if i should send the item or not!

Refund it, email / call them and say that paypal emailed to say there was an irregularity, would they mind paying cash into your bank, you'll give them free shipping etc.

edit - don't just keep their money and not send it, or wait a few days before sending. be proactive.

Don't be embarressed about not trusting them, that's what they count on, if it all goes wrong by the time you realise the PSP and the person will be long gone. Email them, say 'sorry - I don't trust you' and explain why. A reasonable person will understand, just as a reasonable person has alarm bells ringing from this persons activity / methods.

edit - perhaps ring paypal to confirm the buyers details and explain your concerns - but **get the paypal employee's name**.

Richard

Edited December 22, 2005 by fluffcat1

[Guest chucky.egg]

Definately get the buyers full name and address. Look up the number yourself (don't believe the number they give you) and call them. If you get a confused "I don't know what you're on about" then dont send the item.

If the name and address are genuine (and match the phonebook) then you can at least track them back down.

I try to be trusting, but on the big value items it's too much of a risk. Spend 30 minutes now and you could save yourself all sorts of grief

[Guest peekie]

sounds like its probably easier to advertise items in the local newspaper , if people sell invisable cars and get bids there has to be something wrong with the whole ebay thing. its always a few con artists that destroy something that can be fun :)

my wife has sold things and does not use paypal , she uses the payment through the postman , may cost a few pennys more but its best to be safe than sorry :D

[Guest mcwarre]

Amo,

Be very wary especially after what fluffcat has mentioned..... (i.e. refund it)

[Guest amo]

Theres the man I was looking for! I could remember you mentioning one time to me about paypal scams so was hoping you'd pop by to give me your 2 cents...

Ive already requested for it to go into my bank, can i cancel that request and then refund it to him?

[Guest mcwarre]

Amo,

Wait for it to get to your bank account; 5-7 days. Once there it is safe (but I would delete any direct debit you have with PP just in case once the money is in). The worst PP could do if it later turned out to be a fraudulant transaction is to put your PP account into debit for that amount. So what? Just don't use that account :)

I don't believe that you can cancel the transfer yourself. You may have to call PP and that would get rather messy. I would wait if I were you. Do not, under any circumstances, send the item until the money hits your account. You could pull the guys contactdetails and call him and say something about having to goto see your poor Granny or summing so postage would be delayed (but only slightly) :D

PM me his eBay user ID and I will do some digging ;)

[Guest fluffcat1]

Amo,

Wait for it to get to your bank account; 5-7 days. Once there it is safe (but I would delete any direct debit you have with PP just in case once the money is in). The worst PP could do if it later turned out to be a fraudulant transaction is to put your PP account into debit for that amount. So what? Just don't use that account :)

If you do that, and a chargeback is attempted or the card is stolen, they will try to recover the money through a company called NCO.

http://www.paypalsucks.com/forums/showthre...727&old_block=0

Closing your account only protects you from ebay 'not as described' claims etc, if Visa are involved then Paypal have no choice but to refund the money ( as visa can remove their merchant clearing status ) and try to recover it, which for £270 they will. Follow the link for more info.

Richard

[Guest mcwarre]

If you do that, and a chargeback is attempted or the card is stolen, they will try to recover the money through a company called NCO.

http://www.paypalsucks.com/forums/showthre...727&old_block=0

Closing your account only protects you from ebay 'not as described' claims etc, if Visa are involved then Paypal have no choice but to refund the money ( as visa can remove their merchant clearing status ) and try to recover it, which for £270 they will. Follow the link for more info.

Richard

Ouch!!!! I though that the taxman was bad..................

[Guest amo]

Oh dear there's so much to take in! So, what seems to be the verdict as to what I should do?

[Guest chucky.egg]

Basically:

1) check the name and address the buyer gave are genuine

2) get the phone number of the buyer YOURSELF and ring it to check they've bought your item

3) if anything doesn't seem "right" then pull out, you can always sell it again

4) if everything looks OK then send it Special Delivery, or at least Recorded

If you want to be really safe then don't use Paypal. Period. Refund the money and ask for direct bank transfer (takes 5 days between different banks in the UK) and it could cause the sale to fall through

[Guest nickcornaglia]

I got screwed the other way around buying a new laptop from what turned out to be a stolen account.....I lost $1400. ;)

The fraudulent seller protected himself by shipping a box of junk. (Dirty hubcaps, a broken printer and moldy duffle bags).

Since they shipped SOMETHING paypal washed their hands of it.

Since Visa payed PayPal...there was no buyer protection available to me.

The police did nothing in my town nor the seller's town. I provide full photos including the lable that said it was shipped from a mail place AND a lable that was underneath that showed the seller's name and address from something that was shipped to them. (It was the same name as on the PayPal account).

So....I will never buy ANYTHING from someone with no/low feedback.

I will never buy high priced items on ebay.

I will not sell high priced items to anyone with low/no feedback.

I will never ship to an unconfirmed address.

FWIW...The guy may have just joined ebay just to purchase these things. Maybe if you require that they pay thru their checking account, it will put you mind at ease as that's harder to do than paying with a stolen card.

BUT....PAYPAL sucks. EBAY sucks. The SanFrancisco Police suck and the FBI suck (as they NEVER responded to my fraud report on their website DEDICATED TO FRAUD REPORTS).

Good Luck.

[Guest mcwarre]

OMG! I have checked my watch and it's not even April 1st.... ;)

[Guest fluffcat1]

What could potentially go wrong? Is there a "hack" im not aware of that allows him to claim the money back off me as soon as I send him the PSP?

So, how did this play out in the end?

Richard

[Guest amo]

Well I still have the money in my bank, has been for about a week now so its gone past the stage to initiate a card chargeback.

However paypal can still claim the money back up to 6 months later. The guy paid about 2 weeks ago and hasnt emailed me asking why he's not received the psp - obviously i still haven't sent it to him as this smells so dodgy!

Im going to refund him his money and get him to do a bank transfer...

[Guest mcwarre]

Im going to refund him his money and get him to do a bank transfer...

BE CAREFUL!!!!!

If you refund it will be from your pp either off of your outstanding balance, from your account or cc. Now if it oes turn out to be fraudulent pp will automatically debit your account (say it was £200). Then as you have refunded him (seperately rather than refusing the payment) you will be another £200 down = £400 in total. ....

[Guest fluffcat1]

BE CAREFUL!!!!!

If you refund it will be from your pp either off of your outstanding balance, from your account or cc. Now if it oes turn out to be fraudulent pp will automatically debit your account (say it was £200).  Then as you have refunded him (seperately rather than refusing the payment) you will be another £200 down = £400 in total. ....

If you actually refund the payment rather than sending him the equivalent amount back, you should be OK as paypal are obliged to reverse the transaction completley in the same way it was made, so any money received by you will be returned to whatever / whos'ever card he used so they don't loose out and no chargeback can be made as it just looks like a refund from a shop. You can't chargeback an amount that's already refunded.

To be on the safeside perhaps call paypal and get them to do it over the phone. I agree, not asking where it is 2 weeks later is suspect.

You can't refund with funds from your own card though, it has to be clear funds already in your paypal account. Something to do with you then not being able to chargeback the refund yourself....

...well dodgy this paypal lark!

Richard

edit - damn USB keyboard lag...

Edited January 9, 2006 by fluffcat1

[Guest Honest John]

Read today's METRO for the latest scam through Pay Pal. Once again, it seems to stem from Nigeria and is a variation on the spoof Pay Pal email scam.

Personally, I would never ever ship anything out of the country using Ebay/Pay Pal. Nor would I buy anything of value from outside the UK unless the seller had more positives than the number of inhabitants of Bognor.

[Guest mcwarre]

Read today's METRO for the latest  scam through Pay Pal.  Once again, it seems to stem from Nigeria and is a variation on the spoof Pay Pal email scam.

Personally, I would never ever ship anything out of the country using Ebay/Pay Pal.  Nor would I buy anything of value from outside the UK unless the seller had more positives than the number of inhabitants of Bognor.

Thanks for that HJ ;) :D

What's that got to do with the op? Mind you he did mention paypal....