New Camera app for Kaiser, and a rant in progress.

[Guest Paul (MVP)]

First of all - this is a temporary holding post while I compose it properly in my mind.

Second of all - I tried the new Camera version posted elsewhere for the Kaiser, and it is much better. It looks ugly tho because of a packaging problem, and the Album in portrait is a bit rubbish, so see attached CAB.

Third of all - my rant. An open letter to HTC (a work in progress)...

Dear HTC

I love your devices, and lots of us here at MoDaCo love your devices, but as your loyal customers, we have a suggestion on how you could potentially improve your product. This suggestions is driven by the rampant ROM ripping that is going on over the web, whereby people are pulling bits out of ROMs to update their devices to the latest and greatest - the updated Camera off for Kaiser is a great example of this.

We all know that ROM ripping is a shady area, but the fact is that end users are drawn towards such activity by a desire to keep their devices up to date and performing as well as they possibly can. I guess this also extends to 'cooked ROMs' for the most part, I think a lot of people apply cooked ROMs to get the latest bits and pieces.

I would like to suggest that it doesn't have to be this way, and people probably don't really want to have to do this, and you, HTC, could do something about it.

I think your users and fans would love to be able to legitimise this process. They would love to be able to get the improvements from you, on a regular basis, and without needing the clever people in the community to tread the shady line of legality that they are forced into now. I think there are benefits for you around doing this too!

Which don't you... Modularise your software builds.

A vast majority of your applications are standard across your devices. Camera, Task Manager, Input Methods, OS extensions... etc. etc. If you packaged these software parts as modules that were suitable for ANY of your devices, and made them available in a simple fashion, people could update legitimately. Surely it would make things easier for you internally too? Actually, I bet you guys do this already. New phone - latest HTC Album - CHECK. Latest HTC Camera - CHECK. Load on device, tweak, job done.

I suppose the next logical step is to Make them easy to update.

We all have devices with Windows Update on now - would that do the trick? New Camera software out, appears on Windows Update, download, install, job done. Or alternatively - put it up on HTC Club? You're controlling access by serial number, so it should do the trick!

OK, so i'm just brain dumping now... but you get the idea.

I would love to see this happen, and it would surely make everyone's life easier.

Discuss :(

P

HTC_Camera_5.04___Album_for_Kaiser.cab

[Guest Monolithix]

Great start and good points raised. There is no excuse for this not to be the case now HTC mostly brand their own devices themselves (and where they don't they should, just like all the other handset manufacturers!)

[Guest Subliminal Aura]

:(

Oh dear I've had to join the rant thread as mine got closed !

Fair dos though Paul... The Camera on the Kaiser really does suck

ps If you could send the following message to HTC I'd be much obliged...

FIX THE f****** camera you piece of &*^*& ***£E234234 b**** c**** s****g ****s

Yours faithfully,

SA

Edited January 8, 2008 by Subliminal Aura

[Guest dolbe666]

I for one have kept the HTC rom as it is with the tweaks I’ve found here and other sites but it’s just a matter of time until I end up going for a "cooked" rom for the fact they are making improvements that I cannot get directly from HTC. This would not be the case if the windows update actually was put to use by HTC and Microsoft to release major and minor driver and software updates wirelessly. HTC is falling behind now with wireless updating, Nokia and Sony Ericsson have wireless update services already in operation, yet we are stuck with what we can scrounge from the web because of the lack of updates. We have an advanced device with little support for updates, surely HTC could do better

[Guest Paul (MVP)]

There are a number of things that really pee me off....

1) Hacked ROMs are always hacked about in such a way that they don't 'feel' original

2) I want a manufacturer ROM on my device, not a hacked ROM

3) There's no reason this isn't possible

4) The legal line is very very grey, and nobody wants to clarify it

5) Some people are making a LOT of money out of ROM hacking

P

[Guest Subliminal Aura]

There are a number of things that really pee me off....

1) Hacked ROMs are always hacked about in such a way that they don't 'feel' original

Tis true these boys are failed developers so what do you expect :(

5) Some people are making a LOT of money out of ROM hacking

How much is a LOT of money ? I don't see any of them wearing rolex watches in the youtube videos - If anything the poor suckers have kids screaming in the background LOL.

[Guest dolbe666]

There are a number of things that really pee me off....

1) Hacked ROMs are always hacked about in such a way that they don't 'feel' original

2) I want a manufacturer ROM on my device, not a hacked ROM

3) There's no reason this isn't possible

4) The legal line is very very grey, and nobody wants to clarify it

5) Some people are making a LOT of money out of ROM hacking

P

Ive had to go with a Cooked rom for my Qtek 9000 because it was deamed to old to update to WM6. I dont like using cooked roms but I didnt like the fact my Qtek was left in the dust with no more updates from HTC or Microsoft. will this be the case with the Kaiser in 2 years. I bet it never sees the light of WM7 though lagitimate channels

[Guest Paul (MVP)]

Well, cooked ROMs with unreleased OS' is a whole different kettle of fish. I'm referring more to updates to the existing OS. New OS versions fully tested on existing hardware is a legitimate expense that may not be justifiable from a business perspective.

How much is a LOT of money ? I don't see any of them wearing rolex watches in the youtube videos - If anything the poor suckers have kids screaming in the background LOL.

I say no more on the subject :(

P

[Guest Monolithix]

I think the issue is that there are no laws specifically for this (until recently, oh and the US made an attempt at one too :/), like media sharing it falls under copyright and distribution legislation. So by that measure the "cooking" of ROMs is not necessarily illegal as i understand it, nor is the distrubution of tools independently developed for carrying out the cooking process. The dubious area is coming by the ROM images and applications in the first place and then distributing them afterwards. This is (apparently) against copyright law and illegal.

But then thinking about it, is distribuition actually illegal? All you posess when you purchase software, music, dvd's and the like is a *license* (sp) to use it, the developer/artist retains the rights to the product. So presumably you can download or upload stuff, but by actually using it you break the law (admittedly a bit of a catch 22 situation :()

Dragging the post vaguely back on track, perhaps the industry built around WinMo isnt big or developed enough yet to start cracking down on this, other than MS legal waving C&D emails in the faces of the larger stores, eg XDA-Devs ftp server. Furthermore, it seems if you *do* cease and decist (sp), then everything is ok, "we don't mind you flirting with the law until we do mind you flirting with the law". Hmm...

I wonder how many of those 800,000 Touch's HTC sold over the summer last year had owners actually bothered about the quality of the software, and if they knew camera/TouchFlo/Taskmanager/etc updates were available would they actually want/care about implementing them?

[Guest dolbe666]

Well, cooked ROMs with unreleased OS' is a whole different kettle of fish. I'm referring more to updates to the existing OS. New OS versions fully tested on existing hardware is a legitimate expense that may not be justifiable from a business perspective.

Sorry my rant spread over to my qtek. :(

Back on topic. The reason I dont want to resort to a cooked rom is becasue I like the look and feel of the HTC rom as it is. If the driver isssues where sorted out with small cab updates through either the update service on the device or HTC's website I would be happy to stay with the HTC rom

Edited January 8, 2008 by dolbe666

[Guest Paul (MVP)]

While i'm ranting, what happened to the Touch keypads for the original Touch?

P

[Guest Monolithix]

Haha, yes! Come on HTC! Sort it out :(

[Guest mandt]

Paul

Is this a 'real' letter (i.e. paper) that you are going to send, or just posting here on MoDaCo?

and I wonder will they listen? let's be honest they've got a pretty captive audience in us all, and as Mono hinted at we're hardly the core customer base are we, more of a finicky, albeit vocal, minority

[Guest Paul (MVP)]

A rapidly growing minority when you look at the volumes and type of people who are leaning towards this kind of thing?

I'll post it in news and send it to HTC if / when I flesh it out a bit :(

P

[Guest Transform]

does the attached app make the camera better? what actually is it?

could i see some screenshots?

[Guest ScrewlooseAZ]

does the attached app make the camera better? what actually is it?

could i see some screenshots?

I loaded this in and it is slightly better. Menu's are easier to use and read. If that Bar at the bottom of the picture was clear so that you don't see the grey bar it would not look so fake. But it is an improvement over the base.

The real thing I dislike about the whole HTC Album is that, When I open the keyboard and set my kaiser on the table to show off my vacation photos to friends, we have to take our heads off and put them on upside down to enjoy the slide show.

Edited January 9, 2008 by ScrewlooseAZ

[Guest Paul (MVP)]

Yeah, it's not really Kaiser optimised. But, it is optimised for the way you hold the phone when the camera button is in the right position.

P

[Guest ScrewlooseAZ]

It seems that it would be a simple thing to flip the screen when the hardware keyboard is activated. But I'm no coder.

[Guest Neil5459]

Even if HTC listen to legitimate comment and complaint, I doubt whether they will even respond.

At present the majority of their devices are sold via phone operators, and the onus for pushing out new ROM versions and updates lies with those operators. I believe this is part of the HTC/Microsoft/Operator licensing agreement.

In Eurpoe (at least) the devices are provided in a highly subsdised form as part of an airtime contract, so there is little incentive for the Telcos to issue new ROM's apart from bugfixes; they would rather promote a new device that does have the 'new' features to new or upgrading contracts. These Telco's have had the option to subscribe to Windows Update since the start of WM6, and to my knowledge none of them have done so (some of them even remove the link on the device)

We can only hope though, and I wish you well Paul in this laudable approach :(