Opera+Symbian vs. Windows and IE?

[Guest Big Ron - No Longer a Mem]

I just stumbled on the following link:

http://www.opera.com/products/smartphone/

which details how Opera (a smaller, faster alternative to Internet Explorer) can be used on a number of Nokia phones. They talk about the non-GPRS Nokia 9210, but confusingly the story uses a picture of the (with GPRS) 7650 as a background. The downloadable PDF brochure seems to depict a Nokia 7650 being used as a web browser.

The resource overheads demanded by Symbian are a LOT lower than Windows, and the same applies to Opera and Internet Explorer. So, on a phone based around a particular processor, you'd expect faster responses from the Symbian/Opera combo without a significant loss of functionality. In fact, as Opera claims to be Flash and Java compliant... you'd expect to be able to view pages that the Win/IE combo cannot.

It would be kind of interesting to compare the 9210 web-browsing experience with the SPV. Even more interesting to compare the 7650 and SPV. Opera's site doesn't say if the Opera email client is supposed to work on phones, but if it does... Well, Nokia owns a lot more of the market than Microsoft. If they have a better software product, they might well find it easy to keep it that way.

If you download the free trial of Opera, install it, and browse the web, then press SHIFT and F11, you get to see what you'd see if you were looking at the same site on a smartphone. There's a difference in attitude here: Microsoft assumes that websites will just have to be re-written (like they were for WAP?!) Opera assumes that they won't be - but that you just might want to look at sites that haven't been.

If the choice is between a grey housebrick with a good track record and a large screen that lets you look at any site - Flash and Java included - or a silver Mars Bar that lets you look at some sites but not others... which do you pick?

Any thoughts?

[Guest Chris b.a.r.f.]

Interesting post with a few valid points. If Opera _does_ run on the 7650 then that's certainly an advantage it has over the SPV - at the minute, at any rate.

The thing is, do you really want a 7650 at any cost and with any software? I don't, not instead of the SPV at any rate. Nokia's recent quality-lapse puts me off a bit, too. An interesting aside: your post, by implication, means that the SE P800 will also run Opera, and that could be a far bigger threat - but the P800's still just too big, excellent though it is. I'd love one but the size (and awful-quality plastics used in it's construction) put me off.

Having managed (at last ;) )to unlock my SPV, I'll be sticking with it for the forseeable future; it does more-or-less everything I could possibly demand of a mobile phone....and if I can't view a few websites, well, I'll live with that. Surely it's only a matter of time before we get Java on the SPV then it'll be *completely* brilliant, bugs 'n' all ;-)

[Guest Bazz]

Opera is generally considered better than IE both in size and what it can render. However I'm guessing that the Smartphone version of IE isn't a straight port from XP so can't say if it will run much slower than Smartphone Opera.

Opera is included with the P800, but is not installed by default. Think there's some lame browser installed by default which sucks. Installing Opera, however, takes up space :-(

[Guest Chris b.a.r.f.]

Installing Opera, however, takes up space :-(

´

Doesn't matter if you have one of the new 1-gig MemorySticks - a snip at 6000-odd DKK - about 500 quid :shock:

Didn't realize Opera is included with the P800....will have to tell my friend to take a look on the CD...

[Guest yatpeak]

´

Doesn't matter if you have one of the new 1-gig MemorySticks - a snip at 6000-odd DKK - about 500 quid :shock:

Actually, the P800 uses Memory Stick Duos, the largest of which is 16Mb.

Wyatt

[Guest Shuflie]

Have a look at this page on the Opera website

http://www.opera.com/products/smartphone/p...ducts/series60/

It says

The browser will not be available for download and purchase for users of the Nokia 7650 due to the memory constraints on the device. Although the browser itself works inside the memory available, there is limited space available left for caching, other applications, and images. A poor user experience would therefore be the result for many people.

Not sure about the P800 but as yatpeak says it uses memorystick duo for memory expansion and that is very limited at the moment then I don't think that it will be much better than the 7650.

(unless you buy a memorystick for use exclusivly for web browsing I suppose)

[Guest Shuflie]

I just used the contact section on the opera website to ask if they have any plan to release Opera on the Smartphone 2002 OS. Perhaps if a few others did the same thing they may consider releasing it for our phones.

[Guest Chris b.a.r.f.]

Actually, the P800 uses Memory Stick Duos, the largest of which is 16Mb.

Blimey - glad I didn't buy one then ;) Heh, a mate's just blown stacks on one, she's going to be a bit upset when I tell her.

[Guest mantrac]

Surely it's only a matter of time before we get Java on the SPV then it'll be *completely* brilliant, bugs 'n' all  ;-)

Yeah... of course! ;) I wouldn't count on that...

Micro$oft never bothered updating the ridiculously spartan IE browser on the old Windoze CE machines (v1.0, 2.0 and 2.11) and nobody released a third-party browser app for them either.

I have never been a PocketPC user so I don't know whether that platform has had individual browser updates but it seems to me that the only time Micro$oft update their web browsers, is when they release a new version of their embedded operating system.

This either requires changing the device all together, upgrading the device ROM or in the best case, flashing the ROM...

The last two solutions belong to the £80+ family of "Accessories"

Add to that Micro$oft's age-old hate for Java (and anything-Sun) and you should expect a Smartphone VM some time around 2013 when the new 4G networks kick in...

[Guest Chris b.a.r.f.]

Yeah... of course!  ;)  I wouldn't count on that...

Micro$oft never bothered updating the ridiculously spartan IE browser on the old Windoze CE machines (v1.0, 2.0 and 2.11) and nobody released a third-party browser app for them either.

Maybe, but it seems that Orange have quite a big influence with regard to which software gets certification for the SPV - maybe they'll push for Java. For non-certified SPV's it _is_ only a matter of time before someone ports Java.

Add to that Micro$oft's age-old hate for Java (and anything-Sun) and you should expect a Smartphone VM some time around 2013 when the new 4G networks kick in...

Cynic! Cynic! Burn him at the MS-heretic-stake :lol:

[Guest HelloDave]

the P800 uses Memory Stick Duos, the largest of which is 16Mb.

Actually you can get 64Mb ones now from Sony US anyway, a bargain at just $69.95... Give me SD's any day!

[Guest Big Ron - No Longer a Mem]

I guess it comes down to a matter of attitude. I've been in the game long enough to remember IBM and Microsoft bickering about Windows 3.0: IMB wanted it to run on a 286, Microsoft took the (ill advised) view that if people wanted it, they'd just have to buy a 386. Gates got lucky - Intel's monopoly on 386 chips was broken, a price war ensued, and 386's dropped in price to an afordable level. Microsoft has a long history of insisting that the world is remade to fit Redmond's specification. (hence the old joke about Microsoft and lightbulbs: "none: Bill gates just declares "dark" to be the new industry standard") Looking at the complaints Sendo were making, even BEFORE the court case, it seems that things haven't changed much. "Here is the operating system, no WAY are we going to change it, now build your phone around it." Symbian on the other hand - in open colaboration with Opera, is a lot more flexible, and can be changed to fit the needs of the hardware maker - and what the hardware maker thinks the CUSTOMER wants or needs. That's never been a big part of Microsoft's thinking.