Android still seems immature

[Guest Shahmatt]

Is it just me but is Android, out of the box, less developed with respect to basic phone and messaging features compared to Symbian?

I am coming from Symbian S60 v3 (on my E51) and I have to say I am a tad disappointed that I must use the market to fix up the phone to get it to a state where I can operate it comfortably.

For example the available message notification tones and ringtones - none of them are any good for catching your attention in a relatively noisy environment. I have to hunt for third party tones in order to get something that captures my attention. Nokia's default "beep-beep.....beep-beep" tone was devastatingly brilliant.

Similarly my apps or podcast player do not pause when I am interrupted by a call or message.

Or is it that Android has been deliberately made sparse in order to allow for greater customization from the marketplace?

Edited May 23, 2011 by Shahmatt

[Guest skybooks]

Is it just me but is Android, out of the box, less developed with respect to basic phone and messaging features compared to Symbian?

I am coming from Symbian S60 v3 (on my E51) and I have to say I am a tad disappointed that I must use the market to fix up the phone to get it to a state where I can operate it comfortably.

For example the available message notification tones and ringtones - none of them are any good for catching your attention in a relatively noisy environment. I have to hunt for third party tones in order to get something that captures my attention. Nokia's default "beep-beep.....beep-beep" tone was devastatingly brilliant.

Similarly my apps or podcast player do not pause when I am interrupted by a call or message.

Or is it that Android has been deliberately made sparse in order to allow for greater customization from the marketplace?

Thouroughly agree with you. This is my first android device, coming from symbian touch.

No question that syncwize and appwise this is years ahead of the symbian system, but paradoxly as far as main phone functionality, the android is far behind.

This starts with rediculous text input shortcomings (partialy remedied by swype), terrible audio volume. No decent ringtones, as you noted. No hardbutton to make or end calls, very irritating if you lose the phone screen and have to start an operation to get it back in order to end a call. I find it impossible to dial if in a hurry, very hit and miss. My symbian was far more accurate. No loudspeaker on the radio, bundled radio app doesnt work. Volume on this blade is comicly disastrous.

Overall, I really miss my symbian and would go back. Web browsing was also far better on the symbian. Android is far cooler with pinch and zoom etc. but simple things like downloads are a real pain. Pages take longer to load.

If you need a new phone and this is really cheap then I suppose youd be happy, I gave up my nokia to get futher up the smartphone ladder and it has been a real letdown.

PC connection is another real setback, no pc suite to instal/bacup/txt via the pc.

Bottom line, as a gadget its pretty cool, yess I can scan bacodes and have it find the cheapest price of an item and the menu sliding is reaaly cool, plus videoes look very good, but as far as a reliable functioning phone, I wouldnt recommend. Perhaps higher end models have some of these issues sorted.

Edited May 23, 2011 by skybooks

[Guest fonix232]

Is it just me but is Android, out of the box, less developed with respect to basic phone and messaging features compared to Symbian?

I am coming from Symbian S60 v3 (on my E51) and I have to say I am a tad disappointed that I must use the market to fix up the phone to get it to a state where I can operate it comfortably.

For example the available message notification tones and ringtones - none of them are any good for catching your attention in a relatively noisy environment. I have to hunt for third party tones in order to get something that captures my attention. Nokia's default "beep-beep.....beep-beep" tone was devastatingly brilliant.

Similarly my apps or podcast player do not pause when I am interrupted by a call or message.

Or is it that Android has been deliberately made sparse in order to allow for greater customization from the marketplace?

It is just you. Yes, you need Market, as it UPDATES the apps you use, unlike Nokia, where if a bug was discovered you had to wait for months to get it fixed, PLUS two months to your carrier to release the firmware (if you bought it branded). And there ARE good ringtones, it's only ZTE who forgot to add them.

Oh and by the way, if you would use a functioning ROM (not a crappy stock ZTE one) then your music, podcast, etc would stop in a call. It does for me (and did on stock too).

And yes, Android's one goal from many is to have the least, the core apps on the phone, and let the user select the other needed.

Thouroughly agree with you. This is my first android device, coming from symbian touch.

No question that syncwize and appwise this is years ahead of the symbian system, but paradoxly as far as main phone functionality, the android is far behind.

This starts with rediculous text input shortcomings (partialy remedied by swype), terrible audio volume. No decent ringtones, as you noted. No hardbutton to make or end calls, very irritating if you lose the phone screen and have to start an operation to get it back in order to end a call. I find it impossible to dial if in a hurry, very hit and miss. My symbian was far more accurate. No loudspeaker on the radio, bundled radio app doesnt work. Volume on this blade is comicly disastrous.

Overall, I really miss my symbian and would go back. Web browsing was also far better on the symbian. Android is far cooler with pinch and zoom etc. but simple things like downloads are a real pain. Pages take longer to load.

If you need a new phone and this is really cheap then I suppose youd be happy, I gave up my nokia to get futher up the smartphone ladder and it has been a real letdown.

PC connection is another real setback, no pc suite to instal/bacup/txt via the pc.

Bottom line, as a gadget its pretty cool, yess I can scan bacodes and have it find the cheapest price of an item and the menu sliding is reaaly cool, plus videoes look very good, but as far as a reliable functioning phone, I wouldnt recommend. Perhaps higher end models have some of these issues sorted.

Not really. You have to get used to this. I had a touch Nokia too before (an 5800), coming to the HTC G1 was weird. Although it had hard buttons, I loved to pick up using the screen, as less buttons means less hw problems (holes where dirt can get in, etc). And, blame ZTE for that shitty IME, the stock one (or any 3rd party from the Market) are a lot better. With Symbian, our problem was that there were NO 3rd party IMEs, only that few Nokia supplied us (and Swype, for 10$). And if you 'hit and miss' in a hurry, you're doing it wrong. I can even type my IMEI while rushing :P

For radio problems, still blame ZTE, it's not Android's fault. Although Andorko is making a kinda good FM radio (will be available for CM soon).

And don't make me laugh, Symbian's browser was the CRAPPIEST in the world. Slow, jerky scrolling, even slower zooming, and it didn't even properly support basic things like proper HTML tags. Android's and Symbian's browser are alike Chrome vs. Internet Explorer 7...

For PC connection, there are a LOT of apps, you can find them easily (one best is Android Commander). And Android's wonder is, that even you can write a PC Suite yourself! Backup can be done from phone, and PC installation is possible with ADB too. And, Android was designed to store stuff on the cloud, not to use a PC-Phone connection.

[Guest haris.b]

Is it just me but is Android, out of the box, less developed with respect to basic phone and messaging features compared to Symbian?

I am coming from Symbian S60 v3 (on my E51) and I have to say I am a tad disappointed that I must use the market to fix up the phone to get it to a state where I can operate it comfortably.

For example the available message notification tones and ringtones - none of them are any good for catching your attention in a relatively noisy environment. I have to hunt for third party tones in order to get something that captures my attention. Nokia's default "beep-beep.....beep-beep" tone was devastatingly brilliant.

Similarly my apps or podcast player do not pause when I am interrupted by a call or message.

Or is it that Android has been deliberately made sparse in order to allow for greater customization from the marketplace?

im also new to android world. before blade i had many nokias, last one was 5530xm. im never going back to symbian and nokia. since the first time i turned on my blade i saw how crappy and buggy symbian is. i dont have the problem with podcast when answering a call but i remember having million problems on symbian ie. crappy proximity sensor did not work properly and every time someon called me if i answered the call without headset the phone just rebooted! i could not use it even for its basic function haha. and IMHO, android market is the best thing on this os. with it u can customize your phone just the way u want it, unlike symbian where if u did not like stock dialer u just had to use it. and ovi store? for me ovi store is the biggest nokia failure. im glad they are shutting it down.

and i can freely say that my blade is far better than some of the best nokia phones.

ps. u can fix all of the problems u have by installing custom rom and customizing it.

[Guest shadowninty]

Thanks Fonix, saved me from posting a loooong message

BTW, Fonix was a well known guy from the Symbian scene.. not just some guy who used a phone for a week

[Guest isambard]

i agree with some of the sentiments. the native s60 browser wasn't too hot, but i haven't seen anything that beats Opera Mini 4 on the E71. So fast and easy to navigate with the 5 way controller. better than touchscreen which surprised me.

strangely, the one thing that stops me from going back is OTA contact and calendar sync.

i would love for there to be a large screen hdpi android device with an E71-like keyboard and key layout. the hardware 5 way controller and dedicated phone buttons are a must. the dedicated app buttons are also great.

[Guest Anil k Solanki]

My two pennies worth is;

ANDROID is simply light years ahead of Symbian. In less than 4 years it has gone from zero to being the major player in the portable device OS space. Nokia dropped the ball with Symbian, Nokia had a massive head start, but they blew it, simple.

Nokia make great hardware, but their software sucks. Which means you can have a great phone with dedicated buttons, but that is all it's really any good for, use as a phone. Forget decent widgets or web browsing.

Google gets the balance of compromises with ANDROID, better than anybody else. I mean APPLE devices don't even have notification lights. That in my opinion takes the one size fits all approach too far. Imagine a car with no indicator lights.

I am a UI dev, I have worked on Mac OS X and iOS software since day of launch for both. Ditto for Symbian, but their dev support sucked, Apple's dev support is excellent as long as you are willing to drink their kool-aid.

ANDROID is not perfect, but they improve so much every 3 months, that I take them very seriously. Long story short, ANDROID allows me to do more with the device in my pocket or bag, it's that simple.

Anil.

PS. My first ANDROID icon and Market Place banner branding came out yesterday. This is the first of many more to come, not bad considering I only got my Blade, and started looking at ANDROID 8 weeks ago.

https://market.android.com/details?id=it.si...e=search_result

Edited May 23, 2011 by Anil k Solanki

[Guest Fou-lu]

Web browsing was also far better on the symbian. Android is far cooler with pinch and zoom etc. but simple things like downloads are a real pain. Pages take longer to load.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

no sensible response to this BS.

Android destroys symbian at web browsing, wtf your talking about downloads? I've been using my phone as a PC , downloaded everything from it, roms, themes, apps, images, etc

also five psx roms 300mb+ each to use on FPSE, there is absolutely no download problem with any android browser.

your joking right?

[Guest Tom Kitchen]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

no sensible response to this BS.

Android destroys symbian at web browsing, wtf your talking about downloads? I've been using my phone as a PC , downloaded everything from it, roms, themes, apps, images, etc

also five psx roms 300mb+ each to use on FPSE, there is absolutely no download problem with any android browser.

your joking right?

Unrelated - Can you get FPSE to run smoothly?

[Guest Fou-lu]

Unrelated - Can you get FPSE to run smoothly?

On CM7 yeah (600mhz not overclocking), that FPSE dev really is incredible, 48 updates in 2months or so, and now it's almost flawless, depends game for smoothness,i can run tenchu 2 at full speed with sound and frameskip set to 30, can get it faster and set 50fps or turn off sound. breath of fire 3/4 + suikoden 1/2, work at full speed with sound and fpse set too 30/50, stuttering is common with real voices though.

with sound off you can run most at full speed with no frameskip.

also not using ISO so could get even smoother using that format.

Edited May 23, 2011 by Fou-lu

[Guest Benti77]

I want to share my experience with Android and Blade.

I came from some years with nokia symbian, last was (actually still is...) 5800, wich I really think is a very good phone, even if dated.

I've also been using IOS since first ipodtouch (still working but now replaced by blade...) and now by my Ipad 1g, so I have a good insight on the OS now in vogue :P

Nokia out of the box is a way better than others, you have maps, a full pack of features and you don't have to care about new apps etc. Infact before knowing about low cost androids I wished to but the new N8.

But... nokia is really expensive (even if n8 has a good camera etc etc etc), and I've been using symbian for too long so I wanted to try something new. Actually N8 is only a new hardware under tha same OS, as say a more powerfull 5800...

Talking about Android... I tryed the first version last year, and it was really ugly, but eclair and Froyo are very good and in my opinin as good as IOS.

Infact if now I would buy a tablet I would be really in trouble between Ipad and many Andrids !

Finally... just to be clear, there's no comparative between 5800 and Blade on web surfing etc.... !

Maybe Nokia gps is less battery consuming... but at the end I paid the 5800 240€ and the blade only 80€ ! <_<

P.S. sorry for my written english :( but I don't have time to check my post on google :rolleyes:

[Guest skybooks]

My Nokia was also the 5800. I had flashed with a custom rom (phoenix), and it performed brilliantly, albeit in "a nokia box".

I wasny clear what I meant with web browsing. True Android web is far better in the big picture, but in the small things I have had lots of trouble with numerous browsers I have tried. Best is the stock browser. Dolphoin one is slow and choppy, skyfire useless with choppy display and slow load time. Downloads are all renamed to *.htm for some reason. Opera is also very good.

Maybe it is just the learning curve.

Take for example the calendar app in Nokia. I had all my reminders and tasks there and it was really easy and practical to use, now I get a picture of a callendar and loads of tiny boxes - rather unintuitive.

Not trying to bash the superior Android system, just noting for iothers to use th information. Clearly some of the issues are hardware related to this fantasticly cheap budget model - Blade.

Any suggestions for a easy ui calendar?

[Guest Benti77]

for calendar, I use smooth calendar that's quite good.

[Guest Mushroom_Lord]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

no sensible response to this BS.

Android destroys symbian at web browsing, wtf your talking about downloads? I've been using my phone as a PC , downloaded everything from it, roms, themes, apps, images, etc

also five psx roms 300mb+ each to use on FPSE, there is absolutely no download problem with any android browser.

your joking right?

to be fair: I have a problem with Swedish spring, I'm pretty sure I couldn't download zips with the stock browser. (though improbably wrong)

Anyhow android lets you change browsers EASILY. In fact change anything easily..

BUT THE WHOLE POINT OF ANDROID IS TO HAVE OUT OF THE BOX CORE FUNCTIONS AND TO ALLOW THE USER TO ADAPT IT TO HOW THEY WANT IT.

[Guest Fou-lu]

picture of a callendar and loads of tiny boxes - rather unintuitive.

Any suggestions for a easy ui calendar?

lol, that calendar really is annoying, i use launcher pro calendar Widget instead :

http://img802.imageshack.us/img802/7228/13...csay1306180.jpg

pretty easy IMO.

[Guest Fou-lu]

to be fair: I have a problem with Swedish spring, I'm pretty sure I couldn't download zips with the stock browser. (though improbably wrong)

Anyhow android lets you change browsers EASILY. In fact change anything easily..

BUT THE WHOLE POINT OF ANDROID IS TO HAVE OUT OF THE BOX CORE FUNCTIONS AND TO ALLOW THE USER TO ADAPT IT TO HOW THEY WANT IT.

you ever try boat browser? pretty neat and clean compared to others, new update yesterday made it faster.

[Guest Mushroom_Lord]

you ever try boat browser? pretty neat and clean compared to others, new update yesterday made it faster.

Yeah might check it out :P

Being on Cm I've just used the stock browser with wifi and opera mini 5 for "mobiledata" browsing, or some "trick" sites.

But aye its probably time for me to change browser :rolleyes:

[Guest k0zmic]

I like Opera Mobile and Miren Browser. Boat Browser is okay. And there's a new version of Dolphin in beta.

In regards to Nokia phones, they may have more things out of the box but put simply the user experience at the same price point (or twice as much) compared to an Android's is far inferior due to Symbian. Although, I've only tried it on a Nokia 5300 not a 5800 or N8.

Their hardware and build quality are excellent, Ovi Maps seem good and as a pure phone there are none better IMO.

The Nokia Meego phone (forgot what it's called) with a slide out keyboard seemed interesting till Meego kind of became second to WP7.

[Guest unrandomsam]

It is just you. Yes, you need Market, as it UPDATES the apps you use, unlike Nokia, where if a bug was discovered you had to wait for months to get it fixed, PLUS two months to your carrier to release the firmware (if you bought it branded). And there ARE good ringtones, it's only ZTE who forgot to add them.

Oh and by the way, if you would use a functioning ROM (not a crappy stock ZTE one) then your music, podcast, etc would stop in a call. It does for me (and did on stock too).

And yes, Android's one goal from many is to have the least, the core apps on the phone, and let the user select the other needed.

Not really. You have to get used to this. I had a touch Nokia too before (an 5800), coming to the HTC G1 was weird. Although it had hard buttons, I loved to pick up using the screen, as less buttons means less hw problems (holes where dirt can get in, etc). And, blame ZTE for that shitty IME, the stock one (or any 3rd party from the Market) are a lot better. With Symbian, our problem was that there were NO 3rd party IMEs, only that few Nokia supplied us (and Swype, for 10$). And if you 'hit and miss' in a hurry, you're doing it wrong. I can even type my IMEI while rushing :P

For radio problems, still blame ZTE, it's not Android's fault. Although Andorko is making a kinda good FM radio (will be available for CM soon).

And don't make me laugh, Symbian's browser was the CRAPPIEST in the world. Slow, jerky scrolling, even slower zooming, and it didn't even properly support basic things like proper HTML tags. Android's and Symbian's browser are alike Chrome vs. Internet Explorer 7...

For PC connection, there are a LOT of apps, you can find them easily (one best is Android Commander). And Android's wonder is, that even you can write a PC Suite yourself! Backup can be done from phone, and PC installation is possible with ADB too. And, Android was designed to store stuff on the cloud, not to use a PC-Phone connection.

Symbian Does power management right (Battery lasts a reasonable time).

The barrier to entry for apps is higher (which is good stops people publishing garbage who have no reason doing so).

The symbian jvm properly supports the java hardware acceleration in armv6.

The other well supported alternative's are C/C++/qt

Nokia is very good at updating firmware. (Get the block and a ufs hwk to flash it no trouble).

Android is pretty mediocre (Fun to mess with but thats about it) even the basics are not complete

[Guest unrandomsam]

I like Opera Mobile and Miren Browser. Boat Browser is okay. And there's a new version of Dolphin in beta.

In regards to Nokia phones, they may have more things out of the box but put simply the user experience at the same price point (or twice as much) compared to an Android's is far inferior due to Symbian. Although, I've only tried it on a Nokia 5300 not a 5800 or N8.

Their hardware and build quality are excellent, Ovi Maps seem good and as a pure phone there are none better IMO.

The Nokia Meego phone (forgot what it's called) with a slide out keyboard seemed interesting till Meego kind of became second to WP7.

The quality of the music player on nokia's is far far superior (supports flac / ogg for a start) it actually sounds quite nice through a stereo or whatever you can play a video through a tv no problem with coreplayer (even HD on a modest speed processor).

The full bluetooth spec works properly.

Remember what android is primarily designed for

To benefit "Google"

Noone else.

[Guest Roph]

FLAC on a phone sounds a little ridiculous, but I'm pretty sure I've read about that being supported. And ogg vorbis is supported, some of android core sounds (camera shutter for example) are in vorbis.

[Guest Shahmatt]

Some good responses here.

Actually I use SS RSL5. I have no complaints about this ROM. It is definitely better than the stock ROM my phone was shipped with.

My trouble is not with the smart-phone capabilities of Android such as web page viewing, games etc. As many have pointed out, the availability of an extremely dynamic market has made having an Android phone almost a privilege. I see update notifications almost daily and I am constantly astonished at the sheer volumes of data that must be moved through Google’s systems to serve these millions of users.

I am more concerned about basic phone functions. See, I expect to be able to take calls, and receive and send messages without a hitch. These should be core Android features and should not need market software to work properly.

Perhaps I have been spoiled by my E51. Hearing the other side speak was never an issue – it was always loud and clear to my ear. I have also never received a complaint on the clarity of my own voice over the phone. I believe Symbian did some kind of voice filtering or enhancing in order to improve clarity and reception. It is possible that some of this is hardware related (with the exception of the screen the Blade has average hardware - weak speaker, sound decoder etc.) but I think Symbian played a part.

Furthermore, as mentioned earlier, the default notification sounds in the Nokia’s I have owned were excellent for any situation. I find it surprising that Google has not come up with any good sounds to pair with Android. I loathe downloading a Nokia SMS notification for my Android device - doesn’t seem right. I am compelled to get third party tones from the market or internet. Despite the millions that seem to be available (Hollywood movie tunes, funny quotes etc.), I can’t actually find anything that is truly “neutral” (for use in the office) and still grabs my attention when in a noisy environment. Nokia’s “beep-beep” SMS tone truly strikes me as a remarkable achievement.

Symbian appeared to have an all encompassing power over any third party apps. My general feeling in using S60 was that, regardless of the poor quality of an app I may have downloaded off some shady site on the web, the very fundamental phone features never seemed to be compromised in any way. There are pros and cons to this of course. The pros being, for example, Symbian would minimize, pause or mute any app when a call or message comes in. I can’t say the same for Android, where it seems as though the basic phone functionalities are always affected in some way by third party apps. This is dangerous and disconcerting. I feel terribly insecure with each new market download. It was comforting that Symbian seemed to separate phone features and “everything else” so distinctly. Btw, my phone does mute the standard music player by does not seem to mute RSS demon, my podcast client.

It is possible that the E51, N95 etc., and this species of phone in general, represented the pinnacle of Symbian technology and I have been spoiled by the good thing. Maybe things have fallen apart in later models. In any case, I like Android but I hope Google fixes some of these problems soon.

Edited May 24, 2011 by Shahmatt

[Guest skybooks]

Some good responses here.

Actually I use SS RSL5. I have no complaints about this ROM. It is definitely better than the stock ROM my phone was shipped with.

My trouble is not with the smart-phone capabilities of Android such as web page viewing, games etc. As many have pointed out, the availability of an extremely dynamic market has made having an Android phone almost a privilege. I see update notifications almost daily and I am constantly astonished at the sheer volumes of data that must be moved through Google’s systems to serve these millions of users.

I am more concerned about basic phone functions. See, I expect to be able to take calls, and receive and send messages without a hitch. These should be core Android features and should not need market software to work properly.

Perhaps I have been spoiled by my E51. Hearing the other side speak was never an issue – it was always loud and clear to my ear. I have also never received a complaint on the clarity of my own voice over the phone. I believe Symbian did some kind of voice filtering or enhancing in order to improve clarity and reception. It is possible that some of this is hardware related (with the exception of the screen the Blade has average hardware - weak speaker, sound decoder etc.) but I think Symbian played a part.

Furthermore, as mentioned earlier, the default notification sounds in the Nokia’s I have owned were excellent for any situation. I find it surprising that Google has not come up with any good sounds to pair with Android. I loathe downloading a Nokia SMS notification for my Android device - doesn’t seem right. I am compelled to get third party tones from the market or internet. Despite the millions that seem to be available (Hollywood movie tunes, funny quotes etc.), I can’t actually find anything that is truly “neutral” (for use in the office) and still grabs my attention when in a noisy environment. Nokia’s “beep-beep” SMS tone truly strikes me as a remarkable achievement.

Symbian appeared to have an all encompassing power over any third party apps. My general feeling in using S60 was that, regardless of the poor quality of an app I may have downloaded off some shady site on the web, the very fundamental phone features never seemed to be compromised in any way. There are pros and cons to this of course. The pros being, for example, Symbian would minimize, pause or mute any app when a call or message comes in. I can’t say the same for Android, where it seems as though the basic phone functionalities are always affected in some way by third party apps. This is dangerous and disconcerting. I feel terribly insecure with each new market download. It was comforting that Symbian seemed to separate phone features and “everything else” so distinctly. Btw, my phone does mute the standard music player by does not seem to mute RSS demon, my podcast client.

It is possible that the E51, N95 etc., and this species of phone in general, represented the pinnacle of Symbian technology and I have been spoiled by the good thing. Maybe things have fallen apart in later models. In any case, I like Android but I hope Google fixes some of these problems soon.

You wicked man... you are just so much more articulate than I am. After reading your post, I think all my ramblings were to try and say what you did... Although I mentioned web browsing, I actually was most bothered by the downloads which are not working. From all the replies, it is clear that this is an issue with my config, I will open a new thread to try and get help. Actual browsing is way better than symbian. BoatBrowser is really good with really great switching between pages and fast load times.

BTW, what is a good or the best sms program anyone would recommend?

[Guest DaveMac]

BTW, what is a good or the best sms program anyone would recommend?

I vote GO SMS, and Pro is now free on the market :P

[Guest Anil k Solanki]

Remember what android is primarily designed for

To benefit "Google"

Noone else.

Pray tell who Symbian and NOKIA benefit? Humankind, or NOKIA shareholders? Get a grip.

I would also love to meet the audiophile who uses Ogg & Flac files on a mobile phone? Utter lunacy.

I get the feeling that some NOKIA fanboys in this thread are more about trolling than progress or the sharing of ideas.

But maybe that is just me.

Anil.

Edited May 24, 2011 by Anil k Solanki