Guest nixy Posted October 14, 2003 Report Share Posted October 14, 2003 I sort of agree.... having too opted for the i-mate rom. The only uncomfortable problem being though...that those who join the i-Mate squad are then no longer covered by the mighty orange protection racket. And from what I have read we are then no longer covered should the phone need to be returned for repair etc. With this in mind it seems really crazy that to sort out the crap battery life or the extremly (personally speaking but am sure most would agree) sms word counter amoungst other rectified issues, one has no choice but to update the ospv with another operators rom update. :?: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paul [MVP] Posted October 14, 2003 Report Share Posted October 14, 2003 It's the age old argument, but Orange are stuck between a rock and a hard place. They need to ensure that updates are ultra stable, but they would also like to keep the clued-up techie community happy... they can't do both! What would you do in Orange's position? With regards to carrots for new subscriber, I think this is a disgrace. How Orange can shout about Orange Fair and then in the same breath offer new subscribers 500 free messages per month but not for upgrades is beyond me. Networks need to take a step back, value their existing customers, and realise that this would likely provide loyalty, brand avangelism and less churn than their current strategy which seems to be new customers at any cost. I, for one, am losing patience. Orange, you're on to a good thing with Smartphone, don't blow it all away... P - In the pub Posted from my SmartPhone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest chucky.egg Posted October 14, 2003 Report Share Posted October 14, 2003 "]Networks need to take a step back, value their existing customers, and realise that this would likely provide loyalty, brand avangelism and less churn than their current strategy which seems to be new customers at any cost. [standing ovation] here here [/standing ovation] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest spacecowboy6982 Posted October 14, 2003 Report Share Posted October 14, 2003 M$ and Orange have found a nice niche in the market and should be doing EVERYTHING in their power to exploit it. However they're not. Releasing one update every twelve months,delaying launch dates and most annoylingly keeping their customers in the dark about pretty much everything should be making them feel uneasy. From where im standing the term "Orange Care" needs rethinking. Of course its all up to them whether or not they take note of their already present customers. "]Orange, you're on to a good thing with Smartphone, don't blow it all away... Need I say more...??? SpaceCowboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest roke Posted October 14, 2003 Report Share Posted October 14, 2003 For as far my experiences with both Orange and Microsoft go, I can't think of any of my problems with their system/phones which has actually been solved... Call both their service lines, and you get the same answer after about one hour of waiting and being redirected to other persons: "We can't tell when the update will be available, but we expect it to be within a short range." btw, call Microsoft and the first person you get will have to ask his colleagues what a smartphone is. I tried 3 times... I bought my phone with practically one sole purpose: using msn messenger when I'm not at home. Every day that I can't use it, will be a day that makes me realise even more how professional those two companies really are. I mean: for a pocket pc, the update is already available for weeks, and they can't manage to make it available for smartphones? Really... :) Personally I live in belgium, and you can't imagine how happy I was when Orange here left the Orange Group and took another name (BASE for the moment). Since that change, everything, including service, problem solving and compensation towards angry cmrs seemed so much easier. and even the tariffs are a lot cheaper now. Since the day France Telecom bought the entire Orange group, I must say that everything the group stood for, has been crunched into the ground. That includes service, transparency, you name it... Having said this, I hope they will realise that there are people who are waiting for that update, so I hope they will do their job for once and release it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rodnav Posted October 14, 2003 Report Share Posted October 14, 2003 and why should O rush out updates that are incomplete/buggy, requiring an update to fix an update (look at latest SAP 1.6 update for proof, in fact its almost a backwards step), O are doing the correct thing, making sure this update is ready when it is ready and not before :) you are absolutely right about this, except that it's is actually a step back not almost as i was using Imate 1.5 previously. i've lost: 1. functioning SMS character counter, only works when number is entered. 2. you can only send an SMS to the mobile number stored in the contacts (unlike imate where all the contact numbers are available) 3. you can't seem SMS directly from contacts 4. it doesn't allow ringtones to be saved in the SD card 5. it doesn't allow homescreens to be saved in the SD card 6. tasks aren't displayed completely it's half baked update.... it did solve the battery consumption problem of Smart 1.5 ROM, but this was already resolved in Imate/Qtek 1.5 ROMs. it does have some new features with action engine, like accessing your online accounts directly. but it's the little things that count... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mkonieczko Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 I spoke with Orange Data Services today to complain that IM had stopped working. They confirmed that it was withdrawn yesterday (15th Oct) and a new more secure version :wink: will be available on November 15th. They confirmed that this would be 1.6 but could not comment on what else it would contain. Interestingly the IM problem boes not exhibit on the SPV E200 or the Moto phone and they talked about them as if they were already in the field :?: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mantrac Posted October 17, 2003 Report Share Posted October 17, 2003 My single comment before ducking back out: In it's 2 years of existance, how many service packs have MS released for XP, for example? Erm.... A few hundred?! At least!! Unless you're running a stolen copy of Windows XP, you should be able to go to Windows Update and find that out by yourself.. Most security bugs for example, are patched within a few weeks (the latest) of their discovery. Same applies to hardware issues. Your comparison between XP and Smartphone is flawed to begin with though. XP is a much more modular and open operating system with enormous 3rd party hardware and software support. Smartphone on the other hand, is a much more encapsulated environment with most hardware and software features shared betwen Microsoft, HTC and Orange. If on a PC you don't like the Media Player, you can download and install Apple's iTunes, WinAMP or ZoomPlayer. Similarly, if you're not happy with Outlook for writing your messages on, you could use FireBird or one of the several trillion other e-mail apps out there. I'm sure you can appreciate that we have deliberately not been given/allowed the same amount of choice in the case of the Smartphone OS... If we could get our hands on a bug-free SMS/e-mailer, then nobody would be complaining at Orange and M$ for keeping these apps buggy for over a year... Same applies to Media Player, the Calendar app and a whole host of other things I am not going to bother repeating. The bottom line is: by its very nature, a Smartphone (due to its limited hardware and software interchangeability) depends heavily on good support from its manufacturers. Please, DON'T try to convince me that for almost a year, Microsuck and Orange have been trying to produce a bug-free version of the update.... They are both companies with serious amounts of money and leading industry experience. if they can produce a whole new Smartphone operating system within a year, surely, they can do the same with a humble update. The reason we are never going to see another serious service pack for the SPV and E100, is simply because that would undermine the sales of their new and improved Smartphone 2003... ...which in typical MS style, will be a glorified service pack... in a shiny plastic box... How Smart indeed! -- My contract runs out at the start of November... Small wait and the P900 is mine... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paul [MVP] Posted October 17, 2003 Report Share Posted October 17, 2003 P900? Ugh... It needs to be a LOT better than the P800 (which I owned and sold...) P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest spacecowboy6982 Posted October 17, 2003 Report Share Posted October 17, 2003 P900 with WM2k3 - what dreams are made of... :roll: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest xanadu Posted October 17, 2003 Report Share Posted October 17, 2003 As an Orange employee, I have read official news that 1.6 release date is November 15th, which is a saturday. I guess they mean November 14th as the last update was on a friday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest goinnuts Posted October 17, 2003 Report Share Posted October 17, 2003 an o employee. was told 17th but hey o release dates :wink: . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest morpheus2702 Posted October 17, 2003 Report Share Posted October 17, 2003 Posted from my SmartPhone! what's the difference between an update and a patch? and what version of Smartphone 2002 is the MPx200 running since it isn't affected by the Messenger problem? and have iMate or Eurotel announced updates, since I guess they would be similarly affected by the Messenger problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest nixy Posted November 1, 2003 Report Share Posted November 1, 2003 Mantrac........ EVERYONE OF MY HATS ARE OFF TO YOU!!!! Nicely put mate and not only have you hit the nail on the head but you sunk the nail so far in that its evaporated..... nixy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest paradox ewan Posted November 4, 2003 Report Share Posted November 4, 2003 Being a Microsoft product, i expected many updates for the spv lol But the messanger thing hacked me off somewhat. I think that the orange R & D for the smartphone really sucks, as there is so much more they could be adding into it. There are some great ideas in there, but none of them have really been taken-up. I think the answer for them might be to out-source the coding for the handsets operating system instead of trying to make as much money from Handago partnerships or whatever else it is they are spending their time doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Richie M Posted November 4, 2003 Report Share Posted November 4, 2003 Being a Microsoft product, i expected many updates for the spv lol But the messanger thing hacked me off somewhat. I think that the orange R & D for the smartphone really sucks, as there is so much more they could be adding into it. There are some great ideas in there, but none of them have really been taken-up. I think the answer for them might be to out-source the coding for the handsets operating system instead of trying to make as much money from Handago partnerships or whatever else it is they are spending their time doing. Er you and alot of people seem to mis-understands Orange's involvment: O are not responsible for the OS and the Messenger cut off is defenitley not their fault. It is down to Microsoft and HTC to provide improvments to the OS and a patch for Messenger to Network providers, then it is down to that provider to test it. Orange are renouned for indepth testing of handsets and software compared to other providers (this is why not every handset is available on Orange - as they dont all pass their critiera). Microsoft where very slow in releasing a Messenger patch to existing providers hence the delay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest morpheus2702 Posted November 4, 2003 Report Share Posted November 4, 2003 Richie, that is what Orange say, but is that really the case? I mean, is there any significant handset that is not on Orange that is available on the other networks? I mean, let's say that the latest Nokia didn't pass Orange's 'tests' - you really think it wouldn't appear? Personally, I think the 'testing' is just to see if the Orange logo will stay on the phone without peeling off! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest paradox ewan Posted November 4, 2003 Report Share Posted November 4, 2003 Er you and alot of people seem to mis-understands Orange's involvment: O are not responsible for the OS and the Messenger cut off is defenitley not their fault. It is down to Microsoft and HTC to provide improvments to the OS and a patch for Messenger to Network providers, then it is down to that provider to test it. Orange are renouned for indepth testing of handsets and software compared to other providers (this is why not every handset is available on Orange - as they dont all pass their critiera). Microsoft where very slow in releasing a Messenger patch to existing providers hence the delay. that may or may not be the case- as the smartphone is the only platform that hasn't had the update for messenger, and i think microsoft would want as many people on it as they can get! it think the delay is more likely to be at the orange end, as microsoft have a bigger operation, a little update to msn is nothing for them to do, but seems to be a big deal to orange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest midnight Posted November 4, 2003 Report Share Posted November 4, 2003 thety even apologise for the delays to microsoft smartphones on the Microsoft site, and its the same for SPV, Motorola, Mitac, Samsung, imate, QTEK and SAP and any others I forgot, so yeh, Microsoft delay, you guys just like blaming O for everything dontcha, admit it :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest roke Posted November 4, 2003 Report Share Posted November 4, 2003 Midnight, I agree that it's the same for all phones, and Microsoft was indeed very late with their patch, but... Orange has that patch for already a long time now, and all they do is wait until they can launch the new ROM. Couldn't they just provide us the patch for messenger as being a partial upgrade instead of forcing us to "upgrade" our ROM? They would sure have made a lot of us really happy, wouldn't they? But no, I don't think they have the brains to do such a thing. After all, that would mean they actually have to work for something... :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest I. C. Monsters Posted November 4, 2003 Report Share Posted November 4, 2003 I've just installed the i-Mate update after a complete phone failure. Now my old SPV feels like a new phone! It's even got a fully functional SMS character counter. Also does without all the orange junk, including the stupid call end sounds. Worth the risk if you're up to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest roke Posted November 4, 2003 Report Share Posted November 4, 2003 Not to spoil the fun, but the I-Mate update is just another 1.5 update, not the 1.6 we are discussing here... :wink: With the I-Mate update, you still can't use msn messenger either, and with the 1.6 that should work. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest spacecowboy6982 Posted November 5, 2003 Report Share Posted November 5, 2003 Midnight, I agree that it's the same for all phones, and Microsoft was indeed very late with their patch, but... Orange has that patch for already a long time now, and all they do is wait until they can launch the new ROM. Couldn't they just provide us the patch for messenger as being a partial upgrade instead of forcing us to "upgrade" our ROM? They would sure have made a lot of us really happy, wouldn't they? But no, I don't think they have the brains to do such a thing. After all, that would mean they actually have to work for something... :) Remember - Orange is a business and whatever they think is best for them - they'll do. And if that means releasing the MSN fix within the new update then thats what we've got to put up with. They dont intentionally want to piss their customers off - after all, without us they're nothing. spacecowboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest roke Posted November 5, 2003 Report Share Posted November 5, 2003 you're absolutely right, but all I wanted to say is that they won't make any effort for their cmrs. Releasing such a patch should be no effort at all, but still they don't do that. And if they're not sure about the stability of the patch, they can still launch it unsupported ("at own risk"). That would still make a lot of cmrs happy. What I do in our company (we are a mobile network too), is launch a beta in a non-supported sub-channel. I clearly mention that the company has nothing to do with the beta, and everything happens at own risk of the users. If they somehow mess up their phone, we send it in repair for software flash and they can start over again if they like. We even don't charge anything for the software flash, because after all, they help us to develop working software. Now that's service, isn't it? I wish Orange would do the same, but since France Telecom took over the entire Orange Group, service is not an option for them anymore... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest blackhorse Posted November 6, 2003 Report Share Posted November 6, 2003 what i can tell from inside contacts roll out of the 1.6 patch is 15/16 November. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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