Who would donate money towards app signing[UPDATED 27/03/03]

[Guest Monolithix [MVP]]

The call with Dean Coclin went well, see my other post on it.

[Guest Paul [MVP]]

Doh! Multiple Topics!

OK, so MoDaCo Ltd trading as 'The Application Signing Project' will be set up early next week... how about kicking it all off proper when I get back from the states?

I am also investigating liability insurance, in case one of the signed apps turns bad.... :shock:

P

[Guest Monolithix [MVP]]

ok np, it'll be interesting to see what they (Baltimore) and Orange have to say after their meetng today

Btw, i can post my other thread in here and delete the original if you like...

[Guest Paul [MVP]]

Yeah, i'll lock the other thread now, please post contents in here.

P

[Guest Monolithix [MVP]]

Ok, I finally got through to Dean Coclin and "Steve", one of the Baltimore tech people.

First off, if this programme does go ahead and we are able to purchase the certificates, we need to bear in mind that the company that registers the certificate is liable for all applications that they distribute. So if any malicious code does get signed and distributed, we are responsible for any repercussions. This could risk losing all certifications rights etc.

However thats in the far future, and the programme has to be extremely well organised and managed. It has to be professional enough to convince the various relevant companies that we are serious and will not pose a threat to the SPV and Smartphone community. All applications will have to be thoroughly tested and we would need to be very careful over getting genuine contact details for the developers of the freeware.

The validity of the applications and their source would have to be thoroughly checked and both released when signed, maybe through the GPL or a similar (custom) license, again this needs to be thought out extremely carefully and put forward as a specific plan if we are to be successful in getting the certificate signing process

On a more positive note Dean and Steve did seem very interested in supporting the programme, I have given them the address for this website, and they say they will take a look around.

They are also going to be in contact with Orange tomorrow for other reasons, but say they will bring this up and discuss the options we have. So Orange will be made aware of this. Apparently Orange and Mircosoft are also interested in resloving the certification "problem" as soon as possible, it's anyone's guess as to how they will achieve this though...

So overall, the fact that MoDaCo is not the developer of the applications we would want to sign, and that MoDaCo Ltd would be liable for and malicious applications that got signed and were released onto the network are the area's that may cause problems for this programme.

It _has_ to be done professionally, believe it or not Orange and the certification comapnies aren't wanting random people signing applications "for a laugh".

There is some hope, Baltimore will bring up our cause to Orange tomorrow and respond early next week with their response, and both Colin and Steve seemed interested in helping us get the programme going.

All in all a productive phonecall.

To Dean or Steve: if you read this, I hope I have all of the details down correctly and haven't missinterpreted any part of our conversation in any way.

This is at least one small step further to helping develop the development community on this new platform, it will also be interesting to hear Oranges response.

[Guest HelloDave]

Looks like we could be finally getting somewhere with app signing; it's amazing that Orange still hasn't acknowleged all the efforts of everyone involved in this. If it wasn't for this forum don't think the SPV would have been as successful as it has been!

I'm all in support of this project; just a pity I can't program for win CE ;)

[Guest Monolithix [MVP]]

We may have a response from O through Baltimore next week...

[Guest vampyre69]

I would be willing to lend a hand I currently work in the Retail industry but have strong Sales & Marketing knowledge.

What I would first suggest is a business plan, sound silly but try it you need to have a membership system in place to as in Developers subscribe to the service but also having sponsorship would bring in money etc.

Get the Plan written then the research.

Brainstorm it too where do you stand legally? Is it going to be a non-profitable venture or are you planning on making money?

(you would be silly to to make money).

If you seriously want to do it and want some help let me know P.M message me or contact me on [email protected].

No spam or useless emails please.

[Guest Monolithix [MVP]]

I had another e-mail from Dean Coclin earlier today.

There have been discussions about this idea internally at Baltimore and with GeoTrust (the certificate distributers (?)), and he will be talking today with Orange to see if they have any alternative ideas to our suggestion.

Hopefully there should be some more information later this week.

[Guest Paul [MVP]]

Alternative ideas to our suggestion? Does that mean we cannot proceed as planned?

P

[Guest Monolithix [MVP]]

Not sure, we'll have to wait and see what Orange comes up with. Maybe a workaround/freeware only certificate?

Won't know for sure until I get more information from Baltimore later this week.

[Guest fvancaen]

I m Frank Van Caenegem, one of the two developpers of Metro http://nanika.net/Metro.

We are more less finishing the Smartphone version. A beta version is available on the website.

This version is a freeware for more than 3 years.

I really appreciate the idea in this thread. But I don t agree about the idea that the users have to donate.

-Orange has to find a solution not the users.

-Nobody has to be responsible instead of the developpers

-it s so difficult to evaluate good and bad freeware, specially at the begining (most of the freewares got lot of improvments)

-Orange will make enouh money if they support freewares.

For many years, the manufacturers/operator made the same mistakes.

If you want to sell something, you have to provide free SDK and no limitation (remember MS with the first WCE systems, Symbian...).

I got an idea, but I never got any answers. If we find partners to add a small adversting screen in the freeware, but not a nag screen. The developper can get small money (nobody is opposite to get money, but i never got (unluncky)!) and pay the certification stuff.

Of course the partner can be Orange or anybody else ...

It s just my personal thinking, and I just want to support all freewares.

Regards

Frank

[Guest Monolithix [MVP]]

Hopefully after their talks with Baltimore yesterday, Orange may come up with an alterior solution to this freeware "problem".

I'm waiting for the info from Baltimore though, should be here by the end of the week.

[Guest DamianJauregui]

Hi everyone,

I'm a relative newbie here. I signed up this week as I was about to buy an SPV [have now bought one] here in Switzerland.

I am VERY interested in learning how to develop apps, etc. for the SPV as part of my job [Mobile specialist and fanatic for many years now], but, more importantly, am even more interested in seeing useful [written cool] things developed, full stop!

Anyway, I have a limited company [Everlone Limited], registered in the UK, which has specialised in wireless development for many years [Palm, iMode, WAP, etc.]. We have the brochures, the website, etc. and a pretty good reputation with companies like Motorola, Nokia, Orange, etc.

I would like to give something back to the kind of groups that helped me over the last ten years of internet development.

I would like to offer/propose that my company registers [already spoken to Orange, etc.] as a certification house. We can then offer a way for everyone to get things certified.

I'm not interested in making a profit, and would even be willing to pay for the registration of things like Doom, Quake, etc. cause I would love to use it myself.

I've checked the whole GNU licensing thing, and providing that Doom is offered at no cost, with the source cost open for all, it's not a problem.

We're not a charity, just a company in a position to get this thing started!

I want cool apps for my phone... :oops:

Let me know if anyone's interested. I'm happy enough for other people to come and join in, we still have to bug check stuff, etc. before handing it over for signing, or else we lose our trust with Orange.

Hope this helps, if not then let me know and I'll step down [not being the martyr, honest].

Damian.

PS What do I get out of it? A chance for some free software, perhaps...

[Guest Monolithix [MVP]]

Baltimore/GeoTrust/Orange(ish) seem to have taken a larger interest in this idea than i had expected, and i should get an update by the end of the week.

Your offer is very much appreciated and your good terms with Orange should be of benefit. Before anything is done though i would advise waiting for Baltimores response and going over any suggestions that they/GeoTrust/Orange have come up with..

[Guest Shuflie]

Has there been any response from Baltimore/GeoTrust/Orange on the prospect of getting a freeware signing trust going?

[Guest Monolithix [MVP]]

I'm still in contact with Dean Coclin at Baltimore, but he doesn't want the information on what he's been relaying to me to be made public until they are ready.

There are discussions going on concerning this, hopefully there should be more information at the end of next week.

[Guest Paul [MVP]]

Cool, i'd like to get something rolling ASAP...

P

[Guest Myke]

Can the 1st application be a way to add photos to your contacts so when people call it displays their photo?

i would pay $20 !

[Guest Myke]

Any news? Its been about a week :]

[Guest DamianJauregui]

I think you will find that Orange will turn off the cert. requirement on the SPV. Swiss Orange say the UK and France Orange units will very soon.

Our Swiss ones have just be de-cert.

Damian.

[Guest Chris b.a.r.f.]

Our Swiss ones have just be de-cert

Really? How come? And how did Orange implement this? Did you have to d/l an update?

[Guest Monolithix [MVP]]

I think he's referring to the fact that a hard reser will remove the certification requrement on Swiss SPV's.

[Guest Chris b.a.r.f.]

I think he's referring to the fact that a hard reser will remove the certification requrement on Swiss SPV's.

:? it will? eh? Am I missing something here?

[Guest Monolithix [MVP]]

Apparently so...

Some of the Swiss have said that post-Swiss update a simple hard reset removes the certification requirement on their SPV's