Guest FrankyG Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 You asked 'at the time of posting'. Not before posting...and you didn't wait a day for his reply! Was this story so time-sensative you just had to run and be damned? His explanation seems pretty sound to most commentors. Imagine if print / television media ran an inflammatory story without fact checking or waiting for a response / rebuttal. There'd be lawsuits a-plenty! And I wholeheartedly agree. But in the interests of the readership it should be accurate, not posted and corrected / added to afterwards. You assume that readers will do their own followup. If it had been posted in the lounge etc then perhaps. Casual / RSS readers however, who don't follow up on news stories themselves will have left with the impression the Pof is a theif 'cos it says so in Modaco news! If they don't come back to the thread again they'll always think that. And that's down to you. A personal rant on a company webpage can be dismissed as a vendetta, copying it into a news item on a respected windows mobile website elevates it onto another level it may or may not deserve. How did you try to contact Pof? Directly? PM through modaco? Through XDA-devs? Through his website? Through WHOis on his domain and getting a phone number? Something as serious as repeating an allegation of theft would warrant extreme measures to get the other point of view before posting IMO. M.S Hey, Mysterious Stranger- are you POF's lawyer or PR rep? It sounds like you've taken this issue quite personally and won't let go of it. You may have a valid point about Paul posting the original rant prematurely - I for one formed a negative view of POF the moment I read it. However, I feel that Paul would have equally posted similar accusations made against Florin_m assuming it was equally newsworthy. It's up to the individual reader to investigate a story if it's of sufficient interest to him, or don't bother. Do you believe everything you read? It would be a fool who did. With that knowledge, each of us can choose to fully investigate a matter before coming to our (well researched) conclusions. Thats' why I for one headed over to XDA Dev to read more, and subscribed to this thread for the inevitable response. The fact is - as Paul has stated - the item, including the accusation, IS NEWSWORTHY. Your point about TV and Newspapers running articles before all the facts are checked...errr...THEY DO IT ALL THE TIME!! If you're materially affected by a story/web page/blog post or whatever - then you take it up with the accuser. Sure, in due course THE PUBLISHER may have to print a retraction, an apology or clarification. But that doesn't make the original item less newsworthy. IMHO ;) FrankyG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paul (MVP) Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 It's clear we have differing opinions Mysterious Stranger, so I think we'll agree to disagree on this one... You asked 'at the time of posting'. Not before posting...and you didn't wait a day for his reply! Was this story so time-sensative you just had to run and be damned? His explanation seems pretty sound to most commentors. Imagine if print / television media ran an inflammatory story without fact checking or waiting for a response / rebuttal. There'd be lawsuits a-plenty! Yes, I think people were expecting an imei-check unlock, and may have purchased devices on that basis. A personal rant on a company webpage can be dismissed as a vendetta, copying it into a news item on a respected windows mobile website elevates it onto another level it may or may not deserve. It was however never presented as anything other than 'imei-check's rant' (as you put it), in fact it was copied into the topic as a screen grab for a purpose. Also re-read the initial post again. There's no doubt this is an issue that's been bubbling under for a while now in the 'underground', but it looks like things are coming to a head. What's everyone's thoughts? Of course we only have one side of the story, but if there IS IP from imei-check's commercial developments in the 'free solutions', then that's not on. I'll see if I can get a response from pof @ xda-developers on the issue! Pretty fair reporting I thought. How did you try to contact Pof? Directly? PM through modaco? Through XDA-devs? Through his website? Through WHOis on his domain and getting a phone number? Something as serious as repeating an allegation of theft would warrant extreme measures to get the other point of view before posting IMO. That's my business - but I contacted pof using a medium i've used to speak with him before, and I know to be effective. Strange for someone who's always first for unlocking. Stranger still how someone who once relied on other's help / work now lives off the back of the same community for profit now he's learnt what he needed to What's your point? We all start somewhere! Sure, he's not giving back to the community - I wish he would too! - but that's his call. I'm not sure how Florin can generate a revenue stream (is there a market for bulk unlocking?) Oh yes, especially when devices are very hard to unlock! Look at some of the longer history in Nokia unlocking... And I'm sure the guys at xda-developers will unlock the Kaiser - there are some very clever guys there. Maybe, and I hope so! But, from what little knowledge I have of the workings of the Kaiser lock, HTC have raised their game (again)... Anyway, QED... P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mysterious Stranger Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 You may have a valid point about Paul posting the original rant prematurely - I for one formed a negative view of POF the moment I read it. FrankyG Point proved, 'nuff said. M.S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paul (MVP) Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 Sure, in due course THE PUBLISHER may have to print a retraction, an apology or clarification Or update the original post with a link to the other parties response at the earliest possible opportunity perhaps? ;) P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mysterious Stranger Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 Or update the original post with a link to the other parties response at the earliest possible opportunity perhaps? ;) P So you'll show the original allegation in full yet only hyperlink to the rebuttal? Very fair... Like I originally said, you could have merely linked to IMEI check's page rather the re-create it. Edit: all that was needed to let people know about the service not being available was a brief line saying there would be no unlock, and maybe a link to the page explaining why. To re-publish the rant from imei check in it's entireity without Pof's version / comments is one sided and biased towards your sponser. In my opinion ;-) M.S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paul (MVP) Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 Whatever you think mate... P [goes off to make a cup of tea and eat a flapjack] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tsutton Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 I think everyone made their point and everyone will have to agree to disagree with each other. How about... *drum roll* Locking this thread and move on... there are something better out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest FrankyG Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 I think everyone made their point and everyone will have to agree to disagree with each other. How about... *drum roll* Locking this thread and move on... there are something better out there. OR.... Creating a poll. Was the the original news item Fair reporting. YES or NO? I would vote YES ;) Go on...Poll..Poll!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paul (MVP) Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 Hey, i'm a man of the people - vote now ;) Mysterious Stranger - no signing up for 1000 new accounts and voting from each... and posting the link at xda-devs makes the results void :wub: P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mysterious Stranger Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 (edited) Hey, i'm a man of the people - vote now ;) Mysterious Stranger - no signing up for 1000 new accounts and voting from each... and posting the link at xda-devs makes the results void :D P I haven't voted yet but I'm sure the vote will be fair and accurate, just like the reporting, as shown in the screen grab below. :wub: M.S Edited October 10, 2007 by Mysterious Stranger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MARKUKCOUK Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 (edited) I haven't voted yet but I'm sure the vote will be fair and accurate, just like the reporting, as shown in the screen grab below. ;) M.S Ahh I said I'd never post on Modaco again but this is simply too good to miss. Why is it, that back in the day, every free unlocker was posted to the Modaco front page for all to see. Free, or paid for - we heard about it. Why is it that when IMEI-CHECK was started, and became a plus partner, its own unlocks were posted immediately to much approval, but unlocks from the XDA-Devs site were very noticable by their absense. Indeed even talk of some was advised against by the mod team, for fear they were classed as Warez This entire thing STINKS Paul, and your not stupid enough to not realise it. You have a big screengrab of serious and false allegations. You've been blasted by your own members, and your response, which you seem happy with, is to include a small addon link to a response, and sarcastic responses to people who disagree with you. Big news story full of theft allegations vs. a link to a forum post. Really honourable Paul, but then you don't give a s*** about morals these days anyway do you? ----- As for the whole florin_m thing.... I wouldn't have expected anything less. This is the guy who during the first beta of his first unlock claimed he would never ask for money, never sell out, never go against the community. The guy who ****s over anyone who comes close to unlocking. Remember Zone_MR is an unlocker too - also threatened by Florin. The guy is a complete wankstain on humanity, and he's had this coming for a long time. I say to everyone pissed off at this stupid rant by florin - get yourselves to XDA Developers and help POF in ANY possible way you can. Free the phones! ---------- By the way - don't expect much from the poll. Theres plenty of people (Confucious for example), so desperate to be a mod, they will arselick Paul on his way to the ends of the earth. Besides, you don't think Paul will be man enough to admit he was wrong anyway do you? By the way - why is the poll going up AND down? Edited October 10, 2007 by MARKUKCOUK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mysterious Stranger Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 (edited) I contacted pof using a medium.... Doesn't someone have to be in the spirit world to be contactable using a medium?.... :wub: No wonder he didn't get back to you in time. It makes sense now. " Is there anybody there? Anybody called Pof? Pof,it's Paul from Modaco! Pof? Anybody?....Hellloooo?" You'd think in this age of mobile devices things like a Ouja board would be obsolete but obviously not. ;) M.S Edit -reading this back, your tenses seem confused ( to me at least) You first side "I'll try to get a response" - a contraction of "I will" - future tense, implying you haven't already. You then said "I contacted pof" implying you had tried and were succesfull, not "I attempted to contact pof" So which was it? Edited October 10, 2007 by Mysterious Stranger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paul (MVP) Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 Sadly IPB, our software, doesn't let you add polls to existing topics for some reason, so I had to create a new topic with poll, then hack it over in the DB. Fixed now ;) P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paul (MVP) Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 Ahh I said I'd never post on Modaco again but this is simply too good to miss. Well it's great to have you back ;) Why is it, that back in the day, every free unlocker was posted to the Modaco front page for all to see. Free, or paid for - we heard about it. Why is it that when IMEI-CHECK was started, and became a plus partner, its own unlocks were posted immediately to much approval, but unlocks from the XDA-Devs site were very noticable by their absense. Indeed even talk of some was advised against by the mod team, for fear they were classed as Warez I don't recall the mod team advising against unlocks on that basis, only on the basis of a risk of bricking, which applies to ANY unlock (be it free or imei-check). As I touched on before, a 'Plus Partnership' is a way for Florin to give a discount to Plus members yeah, in return for a footer link? It's not some sort of secret society? This entire thing STINKS Paul, and your not stupid enough to not realise it. You have a big screengrab of serious and false allegations. You've been blasted by your own members, and your response, which you seem happy with, is to include a small addon link to a response, and sarcastic responses to people who disagree with you. I don't think my responses have been sarcastic, I think i've tried to put across my viewpoint. Big news story full of theft allegations vs. a link to a forum post. Really honourable Paul, but then you don't give a s*** about morals these days anyway do you? Eh? I'm not sure what that is meant to mean exactly, I assume that is something to do with your beef at me putting a banner up to ad blockers? Not sure how that calls my morality into question! By the way - don't expect much from the poll. Theres plenty of people (confusious for example), so desperate to be a mod, they will arselick Paul on his way to the ends of the earth. Besides, you don't think Paul will be man enough to admit he was wrong anyway do you? Hey, you ARE a nice guy aren't you! P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paul (MVP) Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 BTW, if the topic is just going to becoming a flaming ground, then I will lock it. P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tsutton Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 (edited) BTW, if the topic is just going to becoming a flaming ground, then I will lock it. What I said earlier still stands... everyone got their points across, everyone agreed to disagreed with each other. Everyone had the chance to say what they wanted to say. I think it's enough for now and lock this before we have World War III. Edited October 10, 2007 by tsutton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paul (MVP) Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 I've moved the topic to the lounge, as I don't feel some of the language and attitudes presented by some in the thread is appropriate for linking from the front page. People can say whatever they want, but, well, you know what i'm saying. P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MARKUKCOUK Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 (edited) BTW, if the topic is just going to becoming a flaming ground, then I will lock it. P Fine, maybe you could advise me how best to NOT flame, but try and get you to listen to the people disagreeing with you, rather than just palming them off with excuse and excuse, half of which don't make sense. The last thing I want is to cause the locking of this thread - because I know thats exactly what you'd like to happen, you've already tried burying it in "The Lounge" I see. I'll try a straight forward question to start, and I've put my 'nice' hat on: Why do you include a full screengrab of florin's rant, which has been proven at least partially wrong, but only include a pitiful forum post link to POF's response? Edited October 10, 2007 by MARKUKCOUK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MARKUKCOUK Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 I've moved the topic to the lounge, as I don't feel some of the language and attitudes presented by some in the thread is appropriate for linking from the front page. People can say whatever they want, but, well, you know what i'm saying. P OK, I guess this applies to me - I'll reword my post so it is less offensive, and I'd like you to move it back to the news area, since it is still current major news. Would that be OK? Say the word, and it'll edit and reword my post (not just *** out bits) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mysterious Stranger Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 I've moved the topic to the lounge, as I don't feel some of the language and attitudes presented by some in the thread is appropriate for linking from the front page. P Great. Screw up peoples replies when they try to post in the meantime. Sadly IPB, our software, doesn't let you add polls to existing topics for some reason, so I had to create a new topic with poll, then hack it over in the DB. Fixed now :wub: P Wonder which if any side lost / gained a vote? Very fair, accurate, and totally trustworthy poll now after the originator of a poll has edited it. I'll definatley believe it's result. ;) M.S O.T: Maybe Modaco could get Pakistan to become a plus partner? Lots of common ground re polls, reporting standards etc. Allegedly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SeaneyC Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 By the way - don't expect much from the poll. Theres plenty of people (confusious for example), so desperate to be a mod, they will arselick Paul on his way to the ends of the earth. Besides, you don't think Paul will be man enough to admit he was wrong anyway do you? Or you could just vote yes like myself because unlike the self satisfying "fair and balanced" news reporting allegations be spouted by M.S. (which are of course complete nonsense. Who are you, Fox News? Fair and balanced? Haha!) you could just realise that sometimes stuff gets reported as it happens and you have to wait for the story to unfold. Its not like Paul posted the story damning everyone to hell, apart from IMEI-check. Paul posted the news as it came in. Then he posted the responses as he got them. POF even apologised for the delay in his reply. Get a grip. And exactly which part of "no imei-check Kaiser unlock" can anyone tell me was not accurate. Or indeed fair. However fair reporting the basic fact that they will not be releasing an unlock can be, regardless of the reasons why. If the headline was "No imei-check Kaiser unlock due to blatent IP theft and legal case pending" then i can see where you're coming from. But it wasn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MARKUKCOUK Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 Great. Screw up peoples replies when they try to post in the meantime. Wonder which if any side lost / gained a vote? Very fair, accurate, and totally trustworthy poll now after the originator of a poll has edited it. I'll definatley believe it's result. ;) M.S O.T: Maybe Modaco could get Pakistan to become a plus partner? Lots of common ground re polls, reporting standards etc. Allegedly No need for "Allegedly" - Modaco are happy to post opinion, rants, rubbish as complete fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paul (MVP) Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 Really honourable Paul, but then you don't give a s*** about morals these days anyway do you? Theres plenty of people (Confucious for example), so desperate to be a mod, they will arselick Paul on his way to the ends of the earth. The guy is a complete wankstain on humanity, and he's had this coming for a long time. Mate, that's what I would call flaming and what I would call inappropriate content for linking from the front page. With regards to... Why do you included a full screengrab of florin's rant, which has been proven at least partially wrong, but only include a pitiful forum post link to POF's response? ...I personally left that that was the best way. The responses were primarily from pof and olipro, and again, I wouldn't be comfortable posting olipro's response on the front page. They also deserve to be read in context. To be honest, some of our content above was rude, offensive and unnecessary, and if you wish to claim I don't give a s*** about morals these days anyway do you? then I fail to see why I should be concerned about your posting on or reading MoDaCo for that matter. I'll leave the topic unlocked for the time being... P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mysterious Stranger Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 I don't think my responses have been sarcastic, I think i've tried to put across my viewpoint. P No, you've dissed my reasoning re the reporting and sat on the fence of the main issue. With both sides of the story finally, do YOU think Pof was stealing from Florins work, putting two of his employees out of work, and that Florin is justified in his rant? M.S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest crazyc Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 What I said earlier still stands... everyone got their points across, everyone agreed to disagreed with each other. Everyone had the chance to say what they wanted to say. I think it's enough for now and lock this before we have World War III. I voted that I did not feel the reporting was fair - sorry Paul but there were some good points (yes t was newsworthy tho) made about the coverage of Florins points vs Pofs. BUT This now seems to have descended into a rant the other way - Despite my views on the opening post, I do not see Pauls responses as being sarcastic or in anyway a problem. I have always found this forum to be nice and friendly and that goes for Paul as well. I think that we should be able to debate such things without this getting so personal. In actual fact, the only people who might feel entitled to take it personally are Pof and Olipro, and they have (as far as I am aware) not directed any such anger at paul. Wow -in the time I have written this there have been about a page full of posts. Good to see the red mist pass Mark by the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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