Replacing the NAND - Safe?

[Guest mobiholic]

I was wondering if it would be possible to replace the NAND on a 8GB SGS with that from a 16GB SGS. The scenario went something like this, get a free 8GB on upgrade from my current network, find broken vodafone 16GB handset on ebay or similar and do the NAND chip or motherboard swap, whichever is easier.

When I was considering this I realised that I have no idea if this would change the IMEI of the phone, since changing the IMEI is illegal in the UK under the Mobile Telephones (Re-Programming) Act 2002 I can safely assume that changing it by swapping hardware regardless of the reason (assuming it is done without the manufacturers consent) would break this law.

So my question; is the IMEI stored in the NAND? Does anybody know where the IMEI number is stored and if not the NAND, could I safely swap the NAND chip (if it is removable) or the board it is on without changing the IMEI of the phone? It probably seems like a silly question but I don't fancy risking a hefty fine or up to 5yrs in prison for the sake of an extra 8GB storage :lol:

EDIT - a link to a pic of the motherboard with NAND

Edited July 4, 2010 by mobiholic

[Guest X@nder]

I was wondering if it would be possible to replace the NAND on a 8GB SGS with that from a 16GB SGS. The scenario went something like this, get a free 8GB on upgrade from my current network, find broken vodafone 16GB handset on ebay or similar and do the NAND chip or motherboard swap, whichever is easier.

When I was considering this I realised that I have no idea if this would change the IMEI of the phone, since changing the IMEI is illegal in the UK under the Mobile Telephones (Re-Programming) Act 2002 I can safely assume that changing it by swapping hardware regardless of the reason (assuming it is done without the manufacturers consent) would break this law.

So my question; is the IMEI stored in the NAND? Does anybody know where the IMEI number is stored and if not the NAND, could I safely swap the NAND chip (if it is removable) or the board it is on without changing the IMEI of the phone? It probably seems like a silly question but I don't fancy risking a hefty fine or up to 5yrs in prison for the sake of an extra 8GB storage :lol:

EDIT - a link to a pic of the motherboard with NAND

Why don't you just stick in a 32GB MicroSD card instead of all this hassle ?

[Guest mobiholic]

Why don't you just stick in a 32GB MicroSD card instead of all this hassle ?

Because then I would still be capped at 40GB of storage instead of 48GB.

I'd rather have a potential maximum memory of 48GB on my device, especially one that records in HD and will also be carrying apps, music, videos, images and other files that I would like to have with me.

If it is a lot of hassle as you say then I wont be doing it but without asking the question I wont know if it is a lot of hassle. For all I know it could be a very painless swap and if I can find a broken 16GB SGS on eBay, swap the NAND and then re-list the broken SGS on eBay as the 8GB version it could also potentially be a free upgrade.

Edited July 4, 2010 by mobiholic

[Guest zenkinz]

Because then I would still be capped at 40GB of storage instead of 48GB.

I'd rather have a potential maximum memory of 48GB on my device, especially one that records in HD and will also be carrying apps, music, videos, images and other files that I would like to have with me.

If it is a lot of hassle as you say then I wont be doing it but without asking the question I wont know if it is a lot of hassle. For all I know it could be a very painless swap and if I can find a broken 16GB SGS on eBay, swap the NAND and then re-list the broken SGS on eBay as the 8GB version it could also potentially be a free upgrade.

cost of 8G handset + cost of broken 16G handset < cost of 16G handset?

and to add to that, the hassle of modifying it, unless you are into rolling your sleeves and getting your hand dirty in doing all the engineering work, is not worth the cost saving (if there's any significant one in the first place)

[Guest ToetX2]

Because then I would still be capped at 40GB of storage instead of 48GB.

I'd rather have a potential maximum memory of 48GB on my device, especially one that records in HD and will also be carrying apps, music, videos, images and other files that I would like to have with me.

If it is a lot of hassle as you say then I wont be doing it but without asking the question I wont know if it is a lot of hassle. For all I know it could be a very painless swap and if I can find a broken 16GB SGS on eBay, swap the NAND and then re-list the broken SGS on eBay as the 8GB version it could also potentially be a free upgrade.

Did u even tink about how u get te NAND of the mainbord???

It is not removable like a SD card... The chip is soldered on te mainbord and the "pins" are under the chip.

chiplayout:

so:

Step1: get a 16GB MoviNAND chip, wath is prety hard, becos samsung only use thad chips for samsung product and dont deliver them to other manufacturers, so u need a dead 16GB version on Ebay (wath is also hard becos the phone is new and i gues he has somting like waranty???) and if u get it u need at least a oven to get the chip of.

Step2: put new solder bals on the chip... ( i dont even gona explain this)

Step3: Kill the mainbord of ure SGS and get the chip (i gues agan with a oven) of.

Step4: Put the 16GB chip on ure mainbord and put it in a oven to get the solder soldered xD

Step5: assemble ure device, put it on and see ure wast of time, money and a new dead SGS.

to be short: unless ure realy pro, i meen pro like u can make 5000+ bugs a month, and u have professional tools, i mean real professional tools...

but if u can do thad u can also yust but the 16GB version.... (al thad hassle for 8GB men, for Galaxy S sake....)

Edited July 4, 2010 by ToetX2

[Guest mobiholic]

cost of 8G handset + cost of broken 16G handset < cost of 16G handset?

If I don't think I can sell I can sell the broken handset once I have swapped the board holding the memory I wont go ahead. In addition, if I don't think I can resell the broken handset for at least what I bought it for then I wont do it.

how u get te NAND of the mainbord???

It is not removable like a SD card... The chip is soldered on te mainbord

Thanks that's exactly what I needed to know, the rest of your post just seems like unnecessary flamebait.

It should be obvious from my OP that I had already considered that it might be soldered to the board but I couldn't be sure, that is why I mentioned replacing the entire board OR the NAND, whichever would be easier.

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I'll clarify exactly what I would like to know in case anybody can supply the answers.

1) is the NAND definitely soldered to the board? (I'll assume based on answers so far that it is so this means I would need to replace the entire board it sits on)

2) Is the memory that is storing the the IMEI number soldered to the same board that holds the (presumably) soldered NAND? (because if it is I can't swap the boards because it would change the IMEI of my phone which is illegal)

to be short: unless ure realy pro, i meen pro like u can make 5000+ bugs a month, and u have professional tools, i mean real professional tools...

but if u can do thad u can also yust but the 16GB version.... (al thad hassle for 8GB men, for Galaxy S sake....)

Due to my loyalty discount with my current provider I get my line rental at a considerably discounted rate and they are offering me the 8GB SGS for free. I can only get the 16GB version if I take out a new contract with Vodafone or buy it sim free.

Either of these ways of getting the 16GB version will dramatically increase the cost of mobile phone ownership for me so if I can get a broken phone for cheap, salvage what I need and then sell it and recoup my costs or potentially make a profit why shouldn't I?

I'm not blind to the fact that it wont be a fast or easy way of getting what I want but just because something isn't easy doesn't mean it isn't worth doing if a little time and effort will save me money. All this post is about is exploring that possibility and ensuring that I don't break the law in doing so.

The other option for me is to sell the 8GB version my current provider is offering and buy a 16GB version but this will also potentially cost me extra so I'm exploring ways of getting what I would like for free. I will probably actually do this but why shouldn't I put in the research first and explore all my options to select the best one for me by process of elimination before doing anything?

Oh and assuming that people who have money just spend it without thinking is very naive - how do you think one accumulates money in the first place? It certainly isn't by taking the most expensive option without checking the alternatives or we'd all be millionaires without even trying. :)

Edited July 4, 2010 by mobiholic

[Guest dagrim1]

Perhaps if you know what the problem si with the broken 16GB version it is possible to replace the broken 16GB part with the working 8GB part?

All in all, I think it's both going to be pretty much impossible and you'll risk having 2 broken galaxys and no warranty what so ever of course. And all that for 8GB extra of space?

[Guest BigBearMDC]

From what I can tell the IMEI is stored on the readio chip (likely a QUALCOMM), so you could replace the NAND if you really want to.

A few information about exchanging BGAs (BGA -> Ball Grid Array mounted chips; google will help):

First, you'd need to unsolder it, what is mostly done with hot air.

Then you'll have to place the new NAND chip on PCB, and those chips are very small.

The distance between the PINs is by far smaller than 1 mm (0,1 - 0,3 mm).

When you placed the chip on the PCB, and its somehow fixed, you can resolder it with hot air.

BTW placing the chip on the PCB and fix it is the hardest part.

Usually you check the contacts then with a x-ray machine, to make sure everything is soldered properly.

So this is really something that should only be risked by a pro.

Edit: on the XDA-Developers site there is a explanation on how to exchange BGAs for the HTC Universal (RAM upgrade).

You could have a look at the whole procedure with pictures there.

Edit 2: Have a look at this (YouTube Video).

Best regards,

BigBear

Edited July 5, 2010 by BigBearMDC

[Guest mobiholic]

I wont even attempt to remove the NAND if it is soldered to the board, I do not have the required experience or tools.

Since the NAND appears to be soldered that leaves swapping the entire board and raises the original question of where the IMEI resides. Assuming it is in the radio chip i need to find out if that chip is soldered to the same board as the NAND.

If the radio chip is not part of the board that the NAND sits on then I will consider swapping the board with the NAND on it since the teardown videos show it to be a very simple process.

If it is soldered to the same board as the NAND then that is the end of this idea and I'll move on :)

Thanks for your help everyone!

[Guest BigBearMDC]

I wont even attempt to remove the NAND if it is soldered to the board, I do not have the required experience or tools.

Since the NAND appears to be soldered that leaves swapping the entire board and raises the original question of where the IMEI resides. Assuming it is in the radio chip i need to find out if that chip is soldered to the same board as the NAND.

If the radio chip is not part of the board that the NAND sits on then I will consider swapping the board with the NAND on it since the teardown videos show it to be a very simple process.

If it is soldered to the same board as the NAND then that is the end of this idea and I'll move on :)

Thanks for your help everyone!

I'm pretty sure that every chip is soldered on the PCB, sorry :D

But you could still hand the device over to any chip manufacturer or electronics repair shop and let the chip you want be replaced by them.

That shouldn't cost too much.

Best regards,

BigBear

[Guest mobiholic]

I'm pretty sure that every chip is soldered on the PCB, sorry :P

The same PCB? The teardown I saw showed a lot of removable parts, I didn't know if the chips were spread out over several PCBs within the SGS and perhaps the radio part with the IMEI number was on a different board than the one that holds the NAND?

Anyway looks more and more like i'll not be doing this then! :)

Thanks very much! :D

Edited July 5, 2010 by mobiholic

[Guest ToetX2]

The same PCB? The teardown I saw showed a lot of removable parts, I didn't know if the chips were spread out over several PCBs within the SGS and perhaps the radio part with the IMEI number was on a different board than the one that holds the NAND?

Anyway looks more and more like i'll not be doing this then! :)

Thanks very much! :D

Ure richt, i was a bit over reacted...

Here u can see the mainboard: (with the cpu and the nand)

and the same board on the other side (look @ the battery connector, u can see it is de same board). witch hold some RF chips.

I am not sure were the IMEI number is stored in the cpu or in one of those RF chips, but it is defenetly on this board and it is soldered :S

You can see to hole dissasembly here: http://www.careace.net/2010/06/09/disassem...msung-galaxy-s/

But in my opinion it is alsmost inposible...