SF - total cost of ownership per year?

[Guest SpruceyB]

Hi all,

I am in the market for a new phone (current contract expires in Dec) and like most of you I have been quite excited about the San Francisco as a 'budget' entry level Android phone. I was doing some maths on the total cost of ownership over 2 years, and I found that there are 'better' deals (on paper) out there - for example:

SF £89.99 (assumes £20 discount)

Tesco £10 pcm x 24 months = £240 (that's the cheapest data tariff I have found)

so £330 over 2 years or £165 per year over 2 years

Compare this with the deal from mobiles.com (the carphone warehouse on-line outlet) for an LG Optimus: 14 months free (by rebate) on the Orange dolphin 25, and a free phone - works out £125 per year over 2 years.

Is the SF such a better phone to justify the higher cost? The specs of the 2 phones seem comparable (with the exception of the screen resolution where the SF is better)

Your views would be greatly appreciated,

seg

I sent you a PM regarding a Deal I found for a friend recently.

[Guest seg]

As expected, many good points were made in your replies to my original post - thank you all very much. The point about the SF screen being better is a significant one. I might just have to wait for a week or two until the White SF comes out - I rather fancy that!

seg

[Guest tdodd]

GiffGaff have extended the "free internet" offer to the end of February. For my usage (very few calls or texts) that now means I shall be unlikely to need to top up before then. So that's £85 for the phone, including unlocking, and ~£10 in total for 6 months service. The deal just gets better. :rolleyes:

[Guest ballist1x]

im at 6 months left of my orange contract to go...

so im gonna sell my W995...for £70...bought the SF for...£79...total cost £9...sell the SF in 6 months for £50...

thats on a decent contract where i already got £75 cash back up front for taking out the contract with this phone...

[Guest dragon2611]

I was really tempted by the desire, but there is no way I wanted to sign-up to a 2YR contract.

Currently using an SF on an O2 sim-only tarrif, although i've still got "unlimited" data, think i'd bust the limit on their new tarrifs, can understand Why the networks are limiting data usage, but that doesn't mean I agree with it.

[Guest dragon2611]

I was really tempted by the desire, but there is no way I wanted to sign-up to a 2YR contract.

Currently using an SF on an O2 sim-only tarrif, although i've still got "unlimited" data, think i'd bust the limit on their new tarrifs, can understand Why the networks are limiting data usage, but that doesn't mean I agree with it.

[Guest Broc]

The time spend getting rid of the Orange gunk and getting it to work with giffgaff (which I still haven't) I would probably have been better not to have been so cheap and bought a better phone (or/and network). When you calculate the total cost of ownership, take into account the time it may take you to get it to work the way you want.

[Guest ballist1x]

cost doesnt bother me.

what bothers me with the SF is the lack of width of the screen. its too long and narrow...

i was using a mates Samsung Galaxy S over the weekend and the screen was loads better as its much wider...

[Guest JolyonS]

The time spend getting rid of the Orange gunk and getting it to work with giffgaff (which I still haven't) I would probably have been better not to have been so cheap and bought a better phone (or/and network). When you calculate the total cost of ownership, take into account the time it may take you to get it to work the way you want.

You'll always spend time playing with a new phone to get it the way you want it though - that's part of the fun (for most people on this sort of board, you'd think it would be anyway!)

And you'd always need to do something to get a phone working with GiffGaff unless you got your phone through O2.

So that time isn't really going to be saved by looking elsewhere.

You could pay more and get a better phone - that seems to me to be the choice.

I'm not sure how many better touch-screen 'smart' phones there are, mind.

iPhones, Nexus, Desire, Galaxy S - all very much more expensive (if you can get an iPhone for a total expenditure of under £600 you are doing well).

So I wouldn't (and don't) feel too remorseful about being 'cheap' and getting one of these - you could still change to a better phone and come in under the iPhone price if you wanted.

[Guest seg]

The time spend getting rid of the Orange gunk and getting it to work with giffgaff (which I still haven't) I would probably have been better not to have been so cheap and bought a better phone (or/and network). When you calculate the total cost of ownership, take into account the time it may take you to get it to work the way you want.

I got the SF last Thursday, and I believe I spent about 1 hr taking the Orange gunk off it, following the 'Universal Androot' and 'Titanoum' method - no flashing of new ROMs or anything drastic.

Making it work with giffgaff took another 10 mins (there is a pinned topic in the giffgaff forum about APNs and the SF). As always, Google is your friend.

1.5 hrs of one's time is hardly denting the economics of the SF. It still makes sense.

Mind you, I have probably spent hours and hours playing with it... but that doesn't count as a cost now, does it?? :-)

seg

[Guest spicysomtam]

Three unlimited internet per month is £5. They give u 150mb internet free every time u topup, not to menttion free sms's/minites plus free skype calling/twitter/msm/etc. You can install the Three skype client on the SF. In my opinion the cheapest internet solution. I put a tenner on Three maybe every three months.

[Guest EMMJAY]

Hi all,

I am in the market for a new phone (current contract expires in Dec) and like most of you I have been quite excited about the San Francisco as a 'budget' entry level Android phone. I was doing some maths on the total cost of ownership over 2 years, and I found that there are 'better' deals (on paper) out there - for example:

SF £89.99 (assumes £20 discount)

Tesco £10 pcm x 24 months = £240 (that's the cheapest data tariff I have found)

so £330 over 2 years or £165 per year over 2 years

Compare this with the deal from mobiles.com (the carphone warehouse on-line outlet) for an LG Optimus: 14 months free (by rebate) on the Orange dolphin 25, and a free phone - works out £125 per year over 2 years.

Is the SF such a better phone to justify the higher cost? The specs of the 2 phones seem comparable (with the exception of the screen resolution where the SF is better)

Your views would be greatly appreciated,

seg

May I just add,

The cost of ownership also needs to take into consideration the costings of your electricity billing department.

to paint a picture, Maybe you buy the SF/blade and you charging it everyday, it maybe costing £400/year, HOWEVER you maybe consider the HTC desire which is costing £150 more, and costing £200 less in electric bills (because charging occurs every 3-4 days).

These are by no means true figures but just "painting a sketch" of the logic behind my theory.

in this case i would advise going for a high end device.

Maybe someone could 'shred some light' on how much it would cost in terms of electric units.

[Guest tdodd]

May I just add,

The cost of ownership also needs to take into consideration the costings of your electricity billing department.

to paint a picture, Maybe you buy the SF/blade and you charging it everyday, it maybe costing £400/year, HOWEVER you maybe consider the HTC desire which is costing £150 more, and costing £200 less in electric bills (because charging occurs every 3-4 days).

These are by no means true figures but just "painting a sketch" of the logic behind my theory.

in this case i would advise going for a high end device.

Maybe someone could 'shred some light' on how much it would cost in terms of electric units.

There is a calculator here - http://www.ukpower.co.uk/tools/running_costs_electricity/. If you assume 100% efficiency from the charger, and that you charge the phone for 3 hours every day of the month, then with electricity priced at 10p per kWH (which is the average price per kWH I paid in the last bill) you get a monthly running cost of 4p. Even assuming a terribly inefficient power supply I struggle to see costs to charge exceeding 50p per month, or £6 per year.

My entire fuel bill for gas and electricity is around £900 for the entire year. To imagine that charging the phone might cost £400 of that is beyond preposterous.

EDIT : I've just checked and my annual bill is split £400 for electricity and £500 for gas. I'm at home most of the day and regularly boiling the kettle, laptops on 17 hours a day in total, 40" TV and Sky on the go, electric oven and microwave to be fed, plus the usual stuff like lighting, hairdrier, boiler pump, fridge, router, washing machine etc. etc.. The phone is going to amount to an almost insignificant fraction of my annual cost.

Edited November 17, 2010 by tdodd

[Guest HACKDROID]

ive got the sf and its great and got the t mobile £10 month deal 600 mins 500 tex unlimited landlines and 3gig net which is great ! been just over three weeks and only used 0.42gig of internet so the 3 gig is more than enough for me and ive been using it heavily too !! vidoes movies youtube everything....and the t mobile deal is not a cashback deal or redembtion or anything like that just straight £10 a month 12 month contract sim only deal

[Guest Broc]

Where is that t-mobile deal from? Looking on their site, they have nothing like that http://www.t-mobile.co.uk/shop/sim-only/tariffs/

[Guest quails]

cost doesnt bother me.

what bothers me with the SF is the lack of width of the screen. its too long and narrow...

i was using a mates Samsung Galaxy S over the weekend and the screen was loads better as its much wider...

My wife has a Galaxy S and daughter a san fran, the Galaxy S is better, but not by that much considering the £400 difference in price ! So I would agree, if cost is not a factor and want a large phone the Galaxy S is a really good choice.

Daughter is on Asda PAYG, not using any data as she just uses wifi - so thats just 8p/min calls and 4p/text. I'll move her to a data tariff once the costs get more sensible.

[Guest shawn0]

Buy the SF: £89.99 (assumes £20 discount)

Unlock: Under £2

Buy a T-Mobile 3g sim: £1 or free

Buy a "6 months internet": £20 x 2 = £40 (3gb per month)

(1 Year Oh and don't but it all at once :rolleyes:)

+A topup every now and then.. £30? (I don't text I gTalk.. I don't phone much either I Voip)

First year: £161.99

Every year thereafter: £70

T&C's on T-mobile say its 1GB a month on the £20 plan now.

What are you using to Gtalk with,I'm trying to get to VOIP with my daughters Blackberry but everything seems to be getting shut down.

[Guest mattysk]

there's another big point here for me. I really wanted to buy the Desire which I saw for a comparable price on various online stores. However, every time I did a search for any of these companies there were always about billion complaints. These were generally along the lines of "they said it would be in stock in 3 days but 3 weeks later I'm still waiting". Then with a bit of further research you find that their customer service team are a pile of crap, that if the phone breaks or doesn't turn up you spend forever going around in circles trying to get your money back. Then there are the rumours that you are getting re-conditioned models. Some of these online shops just seem far too good to be true - I "could" have bought a Desire on a decent 24 month contract with a massive TV for £60!

Sorry for what has turned into a rant but I spent weeks wanting to get a phone at a decent price from somewhere without any hassle.

Glad to have been able to walk into an orange shop and buy the phone there and then. Also, my GPS wasn't working so I was able to swap in straight away. I got a £10 deal on T-mobile for more minutes, texts and data than I was using on PAYG for the same £10.

If anyone know of a decent online store that sells phones at a decent price, with decent customer service, where "in stock" actually means they have one and will send straight away and where I don't get automatically signed up to 3 months of insurance which I have to cancel then please let me know. When my SF breaks I'll be very keen to do this!

The other thing is, that if for some reason the SF breaks or I decide it just isn't for me I still have decent SIM and I've only wasted £99 which doesn't feel like a massive risk.

Hope that helps!

[Guest Matt Thompson]

May I just add,

The cost of ownership also needs to take into consideration the costings of your electricity billing department.

to paint a picture, Maybe you buy the SF/blade and you charging it everyday, it maybe costing £400/year, HOWEVER you maybe consider the HTC desire which is costing £150 more, and costing £200 less in electric bills (because charging occurs every 3-4 days).

These are by no means true figures but just "painting a sketch" of the logic behind my theory.

in this case i would advise going for a high end device.

Maybe someone could 'shred some light' on how much it would cost in terms of electric units.

This is paraphrased from a Yahoo answers answer to basically the same question - assume 10p per kWh

Energy in battery = 4.7 Watt hours - this is from the battery itself

Cost = (4.7/1000) x 10 = 0.047 pence per charge

Even if we assume 50% inefficiency in the charger and battery it's still 0.09 pence per charge.

Charging 365 times a year 34pence.

Even if you managed to only charge your high end device once every 4 days (Unlikely in my experience) you're need to own the HTC desire for 582.92 years to recoup the difference in costs.

[Guest oliphillips]

Just to let people know a great 30 day contract sim to get with this phone is the new tesco deal:

£10 a month, 30 day contract : 500 mins, Unlimited Texts, Unlimited Internet.

This deal + Orange San Fran = Great budget smartphone deal.

[Guest gambieter]

Just to let people know a great 30 day contract sim to get with this phone is the new tesco deal:

£10 a month, 30 day contract : 500 mins, Unlimited Texts, Unlimited Internet.

This deal + Orange San Fran = Great budget smartphone deal.

The problem is that Tesco uses the O2 network, whose 3G coverage is poor in the UK. Also, unlimited is not unlimited. I use T-mobile UK SIM only for £10/month with 30 day rolling contract, 100 min/100 text and unlimited internet (1GB) but with both the T-mobile (3G) and the Orange network (GPRS only).

[Guest Azurren]

The problem is that Tesco uses the O2 network, whose 3G coverage is poor in the UK. Also, unlimited is not unlimited. I use T-mobile UK SIM only for £10/month with 30 day rolling contract, 100 min/100 text and unlimited internet (1GB) but with both the T-mobile (3G) and the Orange network (GPRS only).

It's 3gb a month actually for an android phone <3

Can't beat T-Mobile here.. (Well, except maybe gifgaf B))

[Guest shawn0]

How do you get 3gig on T- mobile? Their present T&C's state 1gig a month for £20 for six month. Are you on an older sim?

[Guest gambieter]

It's 3gb a month actually for an android phone <3

Can't beat T-Mobile here.. (Well, except maybe gifgaf B))

I think that's only if you buy an Android phone with them, i.e. a 24 month contract with phone. Also, I have 3 GB with my T-mobile USB-stick, and you can use the SIM in your phone. As long as you don't use it for voice/text, it is no problem.

[Guest twatter]

There seems to be some confusion over T-mobile...............As follows........

1..... Pay monthly plans which include internet on your phone on an Android phone

Internet on your phone Plus comes with a fair use policy of 3GB a month.

Pay Monthly Fair use policy

2..... Pay & Go

This comes with a fair use policy of 1GByte a month

mobile payg boosters

3..... If you purchase a T-mobile Pay & Go with free internet for 6 months - i.e. not people here

This comes with a fair use policy of 500MBytes a month

pay-as-you-go -free-internet

Regards R

P.S So they are now the same company....T-mobile best coverage, cheaper etc